From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Mon Mar 22 07:37:05 1999 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA08061 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 1999 07:37:04 -0600 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id HAA12743 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Mon, 22 Mar 1999 07:32:16 -0600 Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 07:32:16 -0600 Message-Id: <199903221332.HAA12743@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1170 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Monday, March 22 1999 Volume 01 : Number 1170 In this digest: Re: IN> Why on earth can't Malakim fall? Re: IN> Why on earth can't Malakim fall? IN> REPOST: East of Nod Re: IN> Why on earth can't Malakim fall? Re: IN> Why on earth can't Malakim fall? IN> Malakim in chains Re: IN> Malakim in chains Re: IN> Oannes IN> Some thoughts on Dominic. Re: IN> Malakim in chains IN> East of Nod IN> Anti-Spamming IN> The Purity Crusade IN> The Purity Crusade Re: IN> Oannes Re: IN> Malakim in chains Re: IN> The Purity Crusade IN> Kyrio/Shedim questions: Re: IN> Celestial Words in Earthly tongues Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1162 Re: IN> re: malakim IN> In the Beginning (part 2) Re: IN> Anti-Spamming ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 09:02:19 PST From: "Perry Lloyd" Subject: Re: IN> Why on earth can't Malakim fall? >Seems to me that Heaven has an unbelievable advantage with incorruptible >(or so it seems) warriors. Why don't they just make all earthbound >angels Malakim. I've often wondered this myself. If every angel were a Malakite, Heaven would probably we winning the war by now. Then again, making vessels does take a lot of energy and if *every* angel were a Malakite, most of an AA's energy would be taken up with making new vessels. Unless, of course, the AA's started hiring the Ethereal Gods to make Vessels for the Malakim. That would be neat. Michael starts hiring Old Gods to make Vessels, in return they are spared the rod, so to speak. Dominic has to crack down. Could be run from Michael, Dominic, or the Old God's perspective. ;) - -Perry perrylloyd@hotmail.com "Ha! I figured you might try escapin', Bert - so I just took the liberty of removing your horse's brain." --The Far Side Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 09:02:27 PST From: "Perry Lloyd" Subject: Re: IN> Why on earth can't Malakim fall? >Seems to me that Heaven has an unbelievable advantage with incorruptible >(or so it seems) warriors. Why don't they just make all earthbound >angels Malakim. I've often wondered this myself. If every angel were a Malakite, Heaven would probably we winning the war by now. Then again, making vessels does take a lot of energy and if *every* angel were a Malakite, most of an AA's energy would be taken up with making new vessels. Unless, of course, the AA's started hiring the Ethereal Gods to make Vessels for the Malakim. That would be neat. Michael starts hiring Old Gods to make Vessels, in return they are spared the rod, so to speak. Dominic has to crack down. Could be run from Michael, Dominic, or the Old God's perspective. ;) - -Perry perrylloyd@hotmail.com "Ha! I figured you might try escapin', Bert - so I just took the liberty of removing your horse's brain." --The Far Side Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 15:36:18 -0500 (EST) From: Casca Subject: IN> REPOST: East of Nod After I posted this to the list, I realized that there were large chunks of text that had been cut out. I attribute this to the work being written on Word Perfect 7 and transferred to MS Word so it could be posted. Blarg. So here is the complete story. - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- East of Nod She traveled east, across the barren wastes. She was hungry, but she did not cry out. She was thirsty, but her pace did not waver. She was cold in her nakedness, but did not shiver. For to do these things would be to admit weakness, and she was a prideful and vain creature. She was Lilith, the first woman. And she was dying. Not from exposure, or from hunger, or even from thirst....but from the emptiness of her soul. A great, aching emptiness that tore at her spirit like the rocks at her feet. Paradise had been hers and she left it on principle, abandoning it and God simultaneously. It was that abandonment that ate at her, made doubly painful by the knowledge that, if given the choice, she'd do it again. Pride demanded no less. And so she hated. It was an easy enough thing to do, a cold comfort of the mind to accompany the cold winds of the eastern wastes. She hated Adam for his superiority, hated Eve for being her replacement. But greatest of all was the hate she harbored for God: for allowing Adam to treat her so, for acquiescing to his demands for a new mate, and worst of all, for not stopping her from leaving. She hated herself, too, but was too prideful to admit it. And that was why she was dying. "Lilith." The voice had seemed to both surround her and tickle her ear with its warm breath. She looked to see who had addressed her, alone and naked in the cold wastes of Nod. She tried to speak, but her mouth was dry and her throat was parched, and no sound could escape her cracked lips. "Lilith." The voice came again, this time from a point in front of her. And as she watched, an Angel of the Lord appeared before her in all his glory. His hair was black and luxurious, his eyes as blue as the rivers that ran through Eden. He was garbed in shimmering robes of a green more vibrant than the foliage of the Garden. He was barefoot, and where he walked grass grew, the earth turning fertile in each footprint. His wings sparkled like morning dew, and droplets fell from the tips of his feathers into small pools of the purest water. He smiled at her, and in that smile Lilith saw a radiance that rivaled the sun itself. He held out his hands to her, and cupped them, and they were filled with cool water. "Drink," he asked of her. She hesitated. "Drink," he said again, "that I might speak with you." And so she drank from his hands, and the water cooled her throat and eased her thirst, and did not diminish from his hands until she had drunk her fill. "What is your name?" she demanded of him. "I am but a servant of my Lord, and so, you may call me Eli." the angel responded. "I am here because the Lord has not forgotten you, nor has he rejected you. I have come to bring you succor and peace." And Eli gestured about him, for the land had become a fertile oasis while they talked. Lilith shook her head fiercely. "I do not need your mercy, Eli. Neither do I need the Lord's, for He saw fit to cast me out of Eden when I chose not to be a slave to my husband." Eli clucked softly. "Lilith, Lilith.....you left of your own accord. The Lord did not cast you out, nor did He require such an act on your part. He simply allowed you to leave. The two are not synonymous." He shook his head and turned to regard the lake that was forming to his left. "That is something you will learn, given time." He turned back to her. "And I am here to make sure that you have that time, Lilith. It is a very important lesson. You could say it's the most important lesson in the world." Eli smiled at her then, and within that smile was both joy and pain. "And when you have learned it, you will teach it to another." Lilith blinked at him, uncomprehending. "But that is a matter for another time," the angel continued. "For now, your survival is most important. Look, I have created a home for you: food to eat, water to drink, shelter from the elements. Your life will not be as easy as it was in the Garden, but it will be long and full. You will need to learn many things if you are to survive. Three of them I teach to you now." "First, you need clothing if you are to keep warm." With that, Eli removed his robes and wrapped them about Lilith. The green clothing shimmered, and shifted, and wrapped about her so perfectly that she could no longer tell where she ended and the clothing began. "Second, know that you are never without the Grace of God. If you were, you would have died here today." "What is the third thing?" she demanded, both angry and grateful for the charity. "Tell me this, angel, that I might be done with you and left in peace again!" "The third thing," Eli said, smiling as he faded away, "is that you owe me a Favor for this. And one day, I will come to collect it in full. So be not proud and cast away what I have given you, for you will one day repay my service, measure for measure. So you might as well make use of it." And Lilith pondered this, by the shores of the newly-made sea. - -- Casca, Seraph of Archives (bertishg@db.erau.edu) "...I saw the Lord seated on a throne, high and exalted, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above Him were seraphs, each with six wings: with two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they were flying...At the sound of their voices the doorposts and thresholds shook, and the temple was filled with smoke." -- Isaiah 6:2,4 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 14:38:00 -0600 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Why on earth can't Malakim fall? From: Perry Lloyd > >>Seems to me that Heaven has an unbelievable advantage with >incorruptible >>(or so it seems) warriors. Why don't they just make all earthbound >>angels Malakim. > >I've often wondered this myself. If every angel were a Malakite, Heaven >would probably we winning the war by now. No, they wouldn't. If every angel were a Malakim, the countless fronts in the War that require a lighter touch would go wanting. Each Choir has a part to play in the Symphony, the Malakim being but one, albeit a vital one. Not to mention the fact that no demon would ever be allowed to live long enough to Redeem... Also, if every angel was a Malakim, the sin of Pride would run a lot more rampant through Heaven than it already does, what with nobody being able to fall. *g* >Then again, making vessels does take a lot of energy and if *every* >angel were a Malakite, most of an AA's energy would be taken up with >making new vessels. That too. *lol* ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 16:00:26 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Why on earth can't Malakim fall? At 2:38 PM -0600 3/21/99, Prodigal wrote: > From: Perry Lloyd > > No, they wouldn't. If every angel were a Malakim, the countless fronts in > the War that require a lighter touch would go wanting. Each Choir has a part > to play in the Symphony, the Malakim being but one, albeit a vital one. > > Not to mention the fact that no demon would ever be allowed to live long > enough to Redeem... Besides, sooner or later, if *every* angel were a Malakite... sooner or later, there would be no demons left. What do you do with several hundred thousand Malakim *then?* [Doniel] What do you mean... 'peace dividend?' [Michael] Just trust me on this one, Donny. Now, repeat after me. "Would you like fries with that?" [Doniel] Upselling is dishonorable. [Michael facepalms. "Right. I guess we can teach you word processing..."] - -- Eric Alfred Burns |"It was then I felt my heart break like a sabre@annotations.com | fragile Scooby Snack upon the harsh teeth of http://www.annotations.com | Reality -- and it's been broken ever since." http://www.roundrobin.org | --Johnny Bravo ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 13:18:49 PST From: "Janet Anderson" Subject: IN> Malakim in chains Perry Lloyd has written insightfully on the subject of Malakim, my favorite choir. (I knew there was a reason I kept up with this list. After days and days of "Oh, God, not more grammar," two really good articles in one day!) (By the way, I'm pro-grammar myself but refused to add to the brawl ...) However, I take issue with his statement that "the Malakim are without humor, dark and deadly serious." First of all, the APG says that "nothing specifically prevents a Malakite from having a sense of humor." (When I designed my primary PC, I asked the GM about this, and he said, and I quote from memory, "ANY angel can have a sense of humor. Even a Seraph of Dominic.") Second of all, it's my Personal Opinion (TM) that every God-created creature has a sense of humor, just as humans are designed with two eyes and a nose, although what you do with it in this universe of free will is up to you. Some angels probably don't use it much. Seraphs in general probably have trouble telling what's funny, and Servitors of Laurence (Malakim or otherwise)probably don't have time. Word-bound angels might have rather limited ideas of what's funny, especially ones connected with laughter or humor. And they would vary widely. The Angel of Filksongs, a Servitor of Eli in service to Novalis, would have standards of humor completely different from the Angel of Military Humor, a Servitor of Eli in service to Michael, whose last big success was Kipling. Anyway, my primary PC, a Malakite of War, was in a Tether of Marc run by an Ofanite Seneschal, and he (the Malakite) asked if there was a van available for him to use. The Seneschal grinned and pointed out that when you were in a Tether dedicated to transportation there was always transportation available. The Malakite grinned back and said, "Oh, that's right, your motto is 'guaranteed Ofanite delivery." And you ought to hear the conversations between the Malakite and his best friend, the Kyriotate of Eli in service to Yves, on the subject of Servitors of Dominic ... "How many Servitors of Dominic does it take to change a light bulb?" "You mean the light bulb is *dark?" It must be dissonant!" Janet Anderson Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 17:45:04 -0500 From: Matthew Rice Subject: Re: IN> Malakim in chains Janet Anderson wrote: [Snip!] > However, I take issue with his statement that "the Malakim are without > humor, dark and deadly serious." First of all, the APG says that > "nothing specifically prevents a Malakite from having a sense of humor." > (When I designed my primary PC, I asked the GM about this, and he said, > and I quote from memory, "ANY angel can have a sense of humor. Even a > Seraph of Dominic.") Second of all, it's my Personal Opinion (TM) that > every God-created creature has a sense of humor, just as humans are > designed with two eyes and a nose, although what you do with it in this > universe of free will is up to you. [Snip!] I think, when it comes to Malakim, that "intense" might be a better word than "humorless." They are, as a choir, focused and dedicated on very specific goals (kill demons!), and having a sense of humor might seem needless to them. What's more, a sense of humor is one of those things that takes time to develop, and atrophies without use. And most Malakim probably don't spend a lot of time laughing. Those who serve fairly laid-back Superiors (who are, in turn, probably not going to have many Malakim in their ranks) are more likely to crack jokes, albeit not very often; Eli would get a kick out of it, as would Janus (depending on his mood) and Novalis. So, a Malakite with a sense of humor is probably going to be pretty rare--and all of his Malakim buddies are going to turn to him a lot and say "What are you laughing at?" Of course, Malakim can probably pull off deadpan like nobody's business. It would also be pretty funny to have a naturally dour Malakim TRYING to have a sense of humor. Matthew Rice Mercurian of Road Trips ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 18:05:36 -0500 (EST) From: Pee Kitty Subject: Re: IN> Oannes That was pretty damned good...not a Superior I can see anyone jumping to serve, really (only because most of the other Words are so much "cooler"), but a good treatment of the Word, definitely. - -- Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian Meow! ::: Thinking about a Tampa Bay Devival in the future - email me! ::: Or go to http://www.cris.com/~pkitty (hell, go there anyways!) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 11:01:11 GMT+10 From: "Leath Sheales" Subject: IN> Some thoughts on Dominic. I've been thinking about Domnic's motivations lately and the people he persecutes: mostly first generation Archangels. Now IMG I play Dominic as dark and mysterious and probably completely screwed up. But anyway, I wrote the following piece to illustrate what others may think of the Archangel fo Judgement. It will be probably be thrown in Em's 'bad fanfic' pile, but what the hell. I hope someone enoys it. Leath (Balseraph of Kobal in Service to Nitpicking). - --------------------------------------------------------------------- (So Far Untitled) The stern-faced, middle-aged man sat on the park bench, carefully watching the interaction between two younger figures in the distance. The young man was an angel of Judgement, tasked with monitoring other angels for signs of corruption. The woman he was talking to was an Ofanite of Creation, slightly dissonant. Dominic frowned at the sight, making a mental note to discover exactly what his servitor reported when the Archangel of Judgement made his next visit. Dominic’s concentration was interrupted when a well-dressed man in his early thirties sat next to him on the bench. Dominic glanced towards the stranger, ignoring him and moving slightly away from the man. He resumed the contemplation of his servitor. "Kids, huh?" said the man sitting beside Dominic, "You can’t trust them, can you?" Dominic did not dignify the question with an answer. "I mean," continued the other man, "You would think they would follow the good *Judgement* of their superior, but instead they do whatever they like." The man’s emphasis of the word ‘Judgement’ and the mention of a superior caused Dominic to look at him again. The man was nondescript, exactly average for a human of that age. The suit he wore was neat but inexpensive, but the man’s manner suggested someone who was accustomed to having his instructions obeyed. Dominic’s eyes narrowed as he finally recognised the stranger. "Lucifer," was all the Archangel of Judgement said. The Fallen Archangel of Light smiled and bowed his head to Dominic. "Still," continued Lucifer, "There is something to be said for young people who disrespect the wisdom of their elders. I mean, what do the old farts think they know anyway? They’ve lost the ability to see clearly, obviously they’re not up to the task. Take you for instance," said Lucifer, turning his body towards Dominic. "Do you realise that envy is a sin?" he asked. "I do not know what you are talking about," Dominic replied truthfully, as a Seraph was bound to do. "Don’t you?" asked Lucifer, "I think you do but deny yourself the knowledge. You, Dominic," he said, poking his finger into the Seraph’s chest, "Are envious. You suffer from the same sins that you accuse others of. Your Judgement is impaired and you are guilty." "Be gone, foul Lord of Lies," said Dominic. Lucifer smiled, "I’ve been reviewing your record. The people you continue to persecute are those who know better than you do. You are a disrespectful young shit, and you expect others to listen to you. I mean, look at your past deeds. The Archangels you have tried and persecuted in the name of your deaf God. Michael was the first, the greatest Archangel, yet you saw fit to bring him to trial for the traits God had created him with. Then it was Gabriel; God’s mad, passionate messenger. Yves instructs her to give knowledge to a mortal, and you try her for Heresy." Lucifer chuckled to himself, "The old fart causes the problems, and you shoot the messenger. Good Judgement. Uriel slipped beyond your grasp, and you never even had a hope of reaching Baal and myself. So now you turn your attention to Eli, possibly the greatest you still have, all because *you* weren’t created first, *you* can’t understand how their minds work. They are closest to God, and you can’t accept that. It’s no secret that you hate Janus, wishing to target him next, but what of Yves? The first soul, the one who creates most of the trouble. Will he be your crowning glory, your final triumph? Will you stand before the ashes of Heaven, Yves tied to the stake, preparing to enact his death sentence? And when Heaven is no more, will you still stand beside your Judgement?" Dominic scowled, "Every word you speak is a lie, you are well titled as Prince of the Damned." Lucifer smiled at the frustrated Seraph, "Or is it that you see in others those traits you most despise about yourself? You are proud, Dominic, proud and stupid. Others pay for your flaws. You envy your elders, and persecute them for your shortcomings, hoping to one day be their equal. It can happen. Look at your old servant. Asmodeus envied you, and now he serves my plans in Hell." Dominic turned to Lucifer and smiled for the first time in this conversation. "It is there that your comparison is proven false, Balseraph," he spat, "I will never Fall and join you." Lucifer smiled and patted Dominic on the shoulder. "You are correct, Seraph, you will never Fall. I don’t want you to, you serve my plans better by staying where you are. Without you in Heaven my victory would be made significantly more difficult. On that final day when I triumph you will remember this conversation and see the essential Truth to my words." With a flash of light Lucifer disappeared. Dominic sat for a very long time on the park bench, staring into the darkness in his soul. - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 17:35:03 -0600 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Malakim in chains From: Janet Anderson >However, I take issue with his statement that "the Malakim are without >humor, dark and deadly serious." First of all, the APG says that >"nothing specifically prevents a Malakite from having a sense of humor." Which was one of the reasons I started playing one, actually- once I read the APG, Malakim were no longer the personality-free bloodthirsty ciphers they had appeared to me. And my Malakim of Laurence (in service to Tzadkiel) has been known to crack his share of jokes, just not when there are demons to rend asunder. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 18:39:28 -0500 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> East of Nod Very nice. But the end of this paragraph seems to have been cut off: >>>Eli clucked softly. "Lilith, Lilith.....you left of your own accord. The Lord did not cast you out, nor did he require such an act on your part. He simply allowed you to leave. The two are not synonymous." He shook his head and turned to regard the lake that was forming to his left. "That is something you will learn, given time." He turned back to her. "And I am here to make sure that you have that time, Lilith. It is a very important lesson. You could say it<<< ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 18:39:33 -0500 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> Anti-Spamming Just an incidental note -- a lot of spammers are kind enough to send out toll-free numbers to call them. Usually these numbers are voicemail boxes. This means they pay for you to call them, and you can fill their voicemail box with, say, the worst heavy metal you can find... - -David ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 18:39:23 -0500 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> The Purity Crusade >>>Could we please let this subject rest for at least a couple months more? I still haven't recovered from last time... :-/<<< Ain't nothing new under the sun. We've just been through "Seraphim And The Truth" (part III) and "The Meaning Of Words" (part V). And I don't think "How Do Geases Work?" has ever died, as a thread. And I'm being somewhat more than facetious. Why do people never get tired of revisiting _their_ favorite topics, but expect those they're tired of to be off-limits? - -David ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 18:39:43 -0500 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> The Purity Crusade >>>If Uriel and his angels killed all the unicorns, and all the dragons, and all the faeries, right there they've committed Genocide three times.<<< _If_ you accept that unicorns, dragons, and faeries are a race. (Faeries are already known to be ethereals, though faerie-corporeal halfbreeds aren't.) And if you accept that killing them was bad in either case. >>>And given that Jordi and Blandine both claimed they slaughtered creatures (according to _The Marches_) I'm going to take the word of two Archangels who know Celestial Matters better than I on this.<<< Blandine was protesting the devastation of human dreamscapes more than the slaughter of ethereals, though the latter upset her too -- she probably was a bit more sympathetic to them. As for Jordi, Uriel claimed he was _creating_ new species, contrary to God's will. >>>In what way were the unicorns harmful? This isn't a rhetorical question -- I honestly want to know the IN past on this. Some creatures I could see as being harmful. Others I can't.<<< In the older myths, unicorns weren't pretty white ponies with candy-striped horns who give rides to cute little girls. They were nasty, evil beasts. >>>I don't use the Bible as History in In Nomine.<<< Neither do I -- but it does make great inspiration for characterizing God and his angels. >>>I have a good number of both non-Christian and non-Jewish Angels, going from the concept that Men wrote these books and were not privy to 'reality' in any of these cases.<<< Ditto -- I wasn't suggesting the Bible should be used as In Nomine canon. >>>In the case of the Purity Crusade, Uriel declared that Those Creatures Not Made By God Must Be Eliminated. specifically to unify the divisive Archangels under a single standard and to "express his devotion to his Word" (according to the history in the _Angelic Player's Guide._) It could be said the second stated reason is innately selfish.<<< It could be... >>>To prove his Devotion to Purity, Uriel destroyed the things he believed were not Pure. A Hellish Justification.<<< Unless he was right. One can argue the same thing about Dominic's judgments... >>>Let's put it in these terms, realizing this is purely for purposes of *my* campaign, and no one else's.<<< In which case, you're certainly free to say Uriel was a genocidal monster teetering on the brink of a Fall. >>>If Uriel's acts were both sanctioned and good all the way up in Heaven,<<< I didn't say that. One of the central points of In Nomine is that Archangels frequently disagree about what's "good." - -David ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 19:21:33 -0500 (EST) From: jadasc@ma.ultranet.com (Jason Schneiderman) Subject: Re: IN> Oannes At 6:05 PM 3/21/99, Pee Kitty wrote: >That was pretty damned good...not a Superior I can see anyone jumping to >serve, really (only because most of the other Words are so much "cooler"), >but a good treatment of the Word, definitely. Agreed. Slightly tangential, but still mostly relevant: IMC, the Word of Vephar (the demonic counterpart to Oannes) is The Deep (or The Depths), rather than Oceans. Gives it more of an ominous, sea-monstery tone to it, don't you think? - - J - --- jadasc@ma.ultranet.com (life) werther@hilander.com (play) "But, except in dreams, you're never really free and don't the sun look angry at me?" _Desperadoes_Under_The_Eaves_, Warren Zevon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 20:09:46 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Malakim in chains At 1:18 PM -0800 3/21/99, Janet Anderson wrote: > > However, I take issue with his statement that "the Malakim are without > humor, dark and deadly serious." First of all, the APG says that > "nothing specifically prevents a Malakite from having a sense of humor." > (When I designed my primary PC, I asked the GM about this, and he said, > and I quote from memory, "ANY angel can have a sense of humor. Even a > Seraph of Dominic.") Second of all, it's my Personal Opinion (TM) that > every God-created creature has a sense of humor, just as humans are > designed with two eyes and a nose, although what you do with it in this > universe of free will is up to you. Right. Celestial Chicken punchlines: Seraph: Why did the chicken cross the road? Isn't it obvious? Clearly he had a specific reason to reach the other side of the road, and so it seems likely, though I have not had independent confirmation, nor have I interviewed or resonated the chicken.... Cherub: Look, he wanted to, all right? I think if we *care* about the chicken we won't look for the reasons *why,* we'll just accept him for who he *is.* Ofanite: The road? He crossed it? Well, it's the fastest way to *get* there, isn't it? So I don't see the humor. I wonder where that road leads.... Elohite: Let's try to look at it from the chicken's point of view for a moment.... Malakite: There's no reason he *shouldn't* cross the road. It's his choice. All we can do is to make sure he knows what's best, and then back him up every step of the way, with sword bright and eyes alert.... Kyriotate: I could see from where I was sitting on the branch eating the nut that there was good feed across the road where I was standing being hungry. And I could tell that from where I was driving the truck down the road that I could make it across without risk. So, I moved me across the road and began eating, then honked as I passed in the truck, and then finished off the nut. What joke? Mercurian: To get to the other side. Oooooold joke, pal. Now, stop me if you've heard *this* one. An Impudite, a Balseraph and a Lilim walk into a bar.... Balseraph: I know why he did. And you would like to know, wouldn't you. But why? Who do you work for. Who sent you here, hmmmm? Djinn: Like I care why. Calabite: He thought I was on this side. He was wrong. Mmmm... fried chicken. Habbalah: He wanted to. He wanted to so badly he could *taste* it. If you ever let yourself *really* feel you'd cross the road *too.* Lilim: Why? He needed to cross the road, that's why. I showed him how. Now he's happy, and he owes me a favor. And now, so do you. Shedite: Yesterday he was happy on this side. Today, he crossed the road. Willy nilly, he just went right across. Tomorrow... oh heh heh heh heh... tomorrow.... Impudite: To get to the other... oh... oh now *that* is *funny.* You have a natural talent, you know that? Tell me another joke -- oh, and let me help you get some of that tension out of your shoulders.... - -- Eric Alfred Burns |"It was then I felt my heart break like a sabre@annotations.com | fragile Scooby Snack upon the harsh teeth of http://www.annotations.com | Reality -- and it's been broken ever since." http://www.roundrobin.org | --Johnny Bravo ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 20:13:09 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> The Purity Crusade At 6:39 PM -0500 3/21/99, David Edelstein wrote: [Much cool stuff] Response sent to e-mail, as I'm enjoying this if no one but David and I am. - -- Eric Alfred Burns |"It was then I felt my heart break like a sabre@annotations.com | fragile Scooby Snack upon the harsh teeth of http://www.annotations.com | Reality -- and it's been broken ever since." http://www.roundrobin.org | --Johnny Bravo ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 19:41:15 -0600 (CST) From: Elizabeth Bartley Subject: IN> Kyrio/Shedim questions: If a Kyrio or a Shedim fails to possess someone, does it know why? In particular, can they tell the difference between 'he made his Will roll' and 'he has too many Forces' and (for Shedim) 'he isn't human'? Can a celestial tell when an unsuccessful possession attempt is made? What about a Soldier, or a mundane? Or would it depend on the reason why the possession attempt failed? Elizabeth Bartley e-bartley@pobox.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 23:36:30 -0500 From: Walter Milliken Subject: Re: IN> Celestial Words in Earthly tongues At 23:33 +0000 3/18/99, Paul Golds wrote: > A Celestial with a Word embodies that word in all of it's >meanings, a good example being the one in the rulebooks >(Can't recall which book at the moment) about the Demon of >Spam suddenly becoming more powerful when his word got the >connotations of unwanted email. It's the IPG (I wrote that section, and am beginning to regret that example....). My answer to what happened there was that the Demon of Spam's Word is actually "the English Word 'Spam'" in demonic, possibly because "Spam" is a trademarked name for something that, as far as I know, isn't made by anyone else. Or maybe Lucifer knew something.... Anyway, "Spam = unsolicited email" traces directly back to "Spam = trademark name of a processed meat product", with a detour through a Monty Python skit. Maybe the demon worked to inspire the skit, with greater results than he knew at the time. - ---Walter ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 00:00:47 -0500 From: Walter Milliken Subject: Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1162 At 18:19 -0500 3/19/99, EDG wrote: >Can a Lilim, therefore, effectively emulate the Seraph resonance? In >other words, could she Geas/2 (or 3) someone: Speak only truth for the >next hour? I would say, definitely yes, with the proviso that it's really "speak what you believe to be truth". >Could she use a high-level Geas to make someone Speak only Truth for the >next hour? I would say that comes under the "impossible Geas" restriction, unless the geasee is a Seraph -- no one else can know Truth for sure. - ---Walter ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 00:08:33 -0500 From: Walter Milliken Subject: Re: IN> re: malakim At 14:14 +0000 3/20/99, Ramesh Satkurunath wrote: >For a moment I was going to say "What about Habbalah who fails to infect >someone with emptiness and makes a 111 on the dissonance roll", I then >looked it up and it seems that it doesn't automatically redeem, it just >knows that it isn't an angel. Interesting... > >Would that mean that you could have Habbalah who know they are demons and >like being demons and so stay that way? See Elizabeth's article on "gray Renegades" in Pyramid about a month ago. I believe it covers this case, among others. Though I don't think it's True Canon, maybe Deutero-canon. - ---Walter ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 04:58:37 -0500 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> In the Beginning (part 2) Now God looked upon His creation and was pleased. But shortly Baal said: "Creation is indeed interesting, but what does it DO?" And Eli replied "It is." So Baal said "God is bored and lonely." Then Metatron said "Create more." But Eli said "This is all there is. I've done my job." So more emanations of God came forth, and the first was that part of God which was stable and unchanging and could bring order to creation and make it solid, and this emanation was named David. The second was that part of God which conceived of ideas, new thoughts from the unknowable mind of God, and brought them to the other emanations, and this emanation was named Gabriel. And the third was that part of God which distinguishes and separates, between that which is God and that which is not, and this emanation was named Uriel. And Metatron said "You have knowledge, you have perception, you have inspiration, you have purpose, you have creation. Let there be form, substance, and shape. Let there be light and darkness. Let there be order from chaos." So God's emanations did God's will, and creation took shape. They formed the heavens and the Earth, and let the places in-between remain vague and undefined. There were now nine emanations. They were named Yves, Mik'El, Lucifer, Baal, Metatron, Eli, David, Gabriel, and Uriel. By now, the nine emanations were bringing forth emanations of themselves. So still these were emanations of God, made of the same being, yet more removed. Later emanations were Asmodeus, Blandine, Beleth, Belial, Dominic, Janus, Jean, Jordi, Malphas, Mariel, Novalis, Oannes, Raphael, and Zadkiel. Some were direct emanations of God, most were emanations of others. Last of all came Kobal; Kobal was the last direct emanation of God. The emanations of God, and the emanations of His emanations, were now numerous. And they fashioned Heaven and the Earth, but frequently changed it. Eli had brought forth creation, but it was unruly creation, without boundaries or rules. And each emanation did as it saw fit with creation, and the Heavens and the Earth were chaos. So Metatron said "Creation is unruly. Each emanation is like the other, but no two alike. There is light and darkness, form, substance and shape. But there is not order, but only chaos." So Metatron sang, for Metatron was the voice of God. Now the other emanations of God marveled, for they had never heard music. And the Song of God was heard from the Heavens to the Earth, and the other emanations joined Him. Then Metatron said "Now you shall not change creation except by singing, for I have given you a Song. So when you alter Creation, see that your Song is pleasing to God." And all of creation had a sound, and each emanation had a sound, and they found that if they did not sing, creation would not change. And Baal said "Let us sing praises of God!" And Mik'El said "Let us sing praises of God, for who is like God?" And the emanations sang praises of God. But each could sing only one part of the Song Metatron sang, and each could only hear one chord of the Song Metatron sang. Now creation took form, and soon there was water and wind and soil, and hot and cold. And then there was life, and the emanations of God marveled. But God was troubled. And Baal said "God is troubled." And Metatron said "We are all emanations of God. There is no one but God. Make others who are not God." And Mik'El said "There is only God. Who else can be like God?" And God was troubled. For His emanations were Him. Creation was a vast and marvelous thing, but he could not see what it might become. All that His emanations did, He did. As your hands may work idly, worrying at threads or scribbling shapes, without your conscious direction, so could God's emanations work at creation. But they could do nothing without God's willing it. God's emanations could not create independently of God any more than your hands can free themselves and fashion things on their own. More importantly, God's emanations knew nothing but what God knew, and could do nothing but what God could do. Just as your hands cannot sew for you if you know nothing of sewing, nor paint a picture for you if you know nothing of painting. And God was fascinated with creation, and curious what might be that He could not see. So God chose one of His emanations. He called back His last emanation, Kobal. And just as Kobal came forth as an emanation of God, so he vanished back into God. Then God brought forth another emanation, and it was Kobal. And Kobal knew a secret. [to be continued] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 13:27:17 +0000 From: Sam Kington Subject: Re: IN> Anti-Spamming David Edelstein wrote: > > Just an incidental note -- a lot of spammers are kind enough to send out > toll-free numbers to call them. Toll-free, that is, in the US. Some of us, happily, live in better countries (ducks flames). Sam - -- INWO Homebrew: http://www.illuminated.co.uk/inwo/ More of my stuff: http://www.illuminated.co.uk/ Not my employer's opinion, no snappy quote ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1170 ******************************** The material here is (C) 1999 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.