From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Sat Nov 25 18:26:03 2000 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA09524 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 2000 18:26:03 -0600 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id SAA24834 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 2000 18:26:33 -0600 Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 18:26:33 -0600 Message-Id: <200011260026.SAA24834@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1939 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Saturday, November 25 2000 Volume 01 : Number 1939 In this digest: Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... Re: IN> In Nomine World of Darkness part 2 Re: IN> Urban Legends Parts I & II IN> Hunter>IN Part 1: Explanations? IN> Hunter>IN: Intro IN> Hunter>IN Part 2: Mechanics Scribblings Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... Re: IN> Magic Re: IN> Magic Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... Re: IN> In Nomine World of Darkness part 2 Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... IN> Re: Deus Ex Machina IN> IN: WoD Character Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... Re: IN> It's not my fault. Really. Re: IN> "No! You fool! That's the Time Eraser Button!" IN> new to the list, the game and all ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 19:21:55 -0800 (PST) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 11:58:59 -0800From: Ryan Elias Subject: Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... Maurice Lane wrote: >> Song of Gibberish (Ethereal) >Hrm. Nice, as always, but one question comes to mind, >and it's a biggie: What exactly prevents people (who >speak three or more languages, which isn't too hard >for Celestials) from doing this without the Song? Nothing, really. However, if I was GMing it I'd require everyone to make a Intelligence roll (to collate the words) every time somebody wanted to say something or understand it. The intent was that the Song made it as easy to understand as normal monolinguistic speech: I'll have to modify to make that clearer. Besides, your 6 Force Soldier-linguist would be also be able to understand (but not reply, unless he has Ethereal Connection), even though he doesn't have angelic multitasking ability. >One other thing that comes to mind immediately is a >stray line from a Kindred of the East supplement, >which talks about a group of highly intelligent >beings who communicate on the fly by creating and >modifying languages. Perhaps a Celestial or Corporeal >version could work withthat? Good one. I'll have to think about that. :) Moe ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Everything else (not that there is, right now): http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/main.html Last updated 9/5/00 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 19:34:21 -0800 (PST) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 15:43:13 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... - - --- Maurice Lane wrote:> Song of Gibberish (Ethereal) > Two of the Archangels already have Attunements that >accomplish this. >One gives a secret language of gestures, the other >(that's Michael's, I think) allows a version of the >Heavenly tongue to be spoken on Earth. Good deal... if you're a Servitor of one of these two Words. Everybody else is twisting in the wind... >If one really needs secure communication, the >Ethereal Song of Tongues will do much the same >thing. ...unless they know the above. Good point. :) Seriously, I'd say that it's a tradeoff: line of sight, variable length, two-way full telepathy that can be resisted versus within earshot , longer fixed duration, vocal communication (plus written applications) that respects privacy. Plus, I'm not sure (even after rereading the description) whether Ethereal Song of Tongues allows for somebody to mentally communicate with everybody at once: whether omnidirectional message transmittal balances out the security issue is a judgement call. :) Moe ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Everything else (not that there is, right now): http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/main.html Last updated 9/5/00 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 19:49:00 -0800 (PST) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> In Nomine World of Darkness part 2 Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 10:21:29 +1100 From: "Azrael/Demigouge" Subject: Re: IN> In Nomine World of Darkness part 2 >Hmmm this seems to converge the 2 systems >effectively...the only thing is, you've listed the >conversions in the wrong direction ~_^... In my limited experience (Good God, do you expect me to add _another_ RPG system to my buying list? I don't play all the ones I own _now_), it looked pretty good, too. I may not consider celestials that wimpy, but it _is_ IN: WoD. Gotta give the poor humans _some_ kind of edge. :) >I also hereby declare that we should all endevour to >create the largest silliest conversion as possible, >combining as many RPGs as we can think of until we >have Abberent/Nightbane/Robotech/Star >Wars/Nobilis/Teenagers From Outer >Space/HOL/WOD/Heroes Unlimited/Shadowrun/Sailor >Moon/Macho Women With Guns/Demon City Shinjuku/Street >Fighter/Trinity/Brave New World/etc/In Nomine. What, no Toon?* Or Paranoia, for that matter? Here I go, spending so much time and trouble to write up IN: Paranoia, and it doesn't even get a mention. Grumble grumble grumble... ;) Seriously, it's funny to contemplate, but we may want to it hosted somewhere _else_. The Djinn Princess of Nitpicking is always lurking. :) Moe *Especially helpful because somebody's already done the Toon/Delta Green crossover... :) ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Everything else (not that there is, right now): http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/main.html Last updated 9/5/00 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 19:56:36 -0800 (PST) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> Urban Legends Parts I & II I enjoyed both of these. The idea of a Word-bound ethereal is precisely the sort of thing that makes Dominic take the celestial equivalent of Maalox. That appeals to me somehow, and I happen to LIKE Dominic. :) Moe PS: I'm sorry, but I must ask: have you seen Terry Pratchett's *Hogfather*? It has a description of the Tooth Fairy in it that you might find very... interesting. Hmmm. An IN ethereal campaign based on the Discworld would be very odd. I wonder if there's an article in there somewhere? ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Everything else (not that there is, right now): http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/main.html Last updated 9/5/00 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 07:23:19 -0000 From: "I. Inayat" Subject: IN> Hunter>IN Part 1: Explanations? (Hmm. Give me a moment... Okay. For those unfamiliar with Hunter: the Reckoning... you play one of the 'imbued', ordinary people who have been empowered by forces unknown, (hence the term 'imbued'), seemingly to break the supernatural's hold on the world and reclaim it for humanity. There _is_ a problem. Well, there are a whole bucketful of them, starting with the fact that _telling_ people you can see monsters is a good way to see a mental ward from inside. Then there's the fact that the monsters deal... rather nastily... with people who go public, or who try to fight them. And then there's the point that as you gain greater power to deal with the monsters, you _also_ go steadily crazier... The forces that 'empower' the imbued are usually known as the Messengers. What they _really_ are is the subject of much speculation among the imbued. Here's one explanation...) - --- In the end, nobody's sure what really happened. They _know_ Saminga was planning something. They're also fairly sure that that _something_, whatever it was, went horribly wrong. They _know_ that, shortly after the explosion which ripped through Saminga's citadel... ...the storm started raging across Hell. A storm even the Princes seemed unable - or unwilling - to stop... ...Lucifer was seen atop the highest volcano in Sheol, laughing into the storm... ...The lightning cracked around him - and he was gone... ...Damned souls were drawn into the storm, into the maelstrom - and disappeared... And started turning up on Earth again. In their old bodies. In other words... ...Zombi Earth. Maybe it didn't go as wrong as people think... - --- Whatever happened, the Archangels soon found themselves overstretched. Though Lucifer was gone, vanished none knew where.... though the Princes were occupied in trying to curb the loss of souls and the devastation that raged across Hell... though their corporeal agents were disorganised, without guidance... ...Overstretched because of the _undead_. The damned had come back.And they'd take whatever they could get. Ghosts. Vampires. Mummies. Zombis. Other, stranger, things. Consider, for a moment. Hell has existed for twenty thousand years. Over that time, _millions_ have found themselves there. If even the smallest number escaped... Hell, despite losing so many souls (read: Essence batteries) rubbed its mutual hands together. At _last_! Maybe that idiot Saminga _had_ proven useful for something after all... - --- It is well known in Heaven that, sometimes, the Archangel of Destiny meditates in Lucifer's old Cathedral. No-one has yet asked him why. When he came out after the latest time... ...the reliever who first saw him is still murmuring about 'ineffable sadness'. _All_ know what happened next: how Yves entered the Seraphim Council, and the _silence_ that followed him like a cloak, stilling the chamber. With him was a hooded figure. The figure spoke softly, his words chilling all who heard them. The Symphony's Fate approached soon, far too soon. Humanity, once more, would be given a choice. A choice to fight the darkness. To fight the monsters. A choice, some said later, that would prove too high. - --- Seven Archangels were chosen. Yves guided those who could see Destiny and Fate - the Visionaries. Khalid took those who would sacrifice themselves in Heaven's name - the Martyrs. Gabriel chose those who desired to avenge themselves on the forces of evil - the Avengers. Zadkiel was given those who sought to protect what they could - the Defenders. Dominic oversaw those who must decide the greater good - the Judges. Novalis watched those who might heal the damned - the Redeemers. And Christopher was entrusted with those who wished the reconciliation of Hell's minions - the Innocents. But God's long-ago law still held. Humanity at large must not learn of the celestial. Even those who had been 'chosen' must remain unaware of the forces at work. They must make the choice _themselves_. More blinded than a Soldier would ever be. More sighted than they could ever dream. - --- The moment of choice - the imbuing - is simple. A human is suddenly made _aware_ of the supernatural, given the choice to _act_ against evil. Those who choose not to act, for whatever reason, are not empowered, not given the sight. They are known as 'bystanders'. Those who _do_ act... ...the Symphony opens up to them, resonates with them. As they listen, they learn more and more... but eventually, it drowns out all else. They _embody_ that theme. It becomes all there is. By that point, they are no longer recognisably human. Mentally. Those celestials who observe the process (and there are many) comment on its similarities to Word-binding... and speculate on how Lilith avoided this... These 'imbued', as humans, listening to that part of the Symphony open to them... ...find ways to _play_ that theme in the Symphony, creating techniques based on that theme. The more adept they are, the more techniques they learn. The more _focused_ on learning a theme they are, the greater the feats they can accomplish. These techniques - these 'edges' - cause no disturbance in the Symphony; a source of surprise to most celestials. But these humans are working _with_ the Symphony, not against it. Learning how it's played... - --- The Archangels are baffled and concerned. The Princes are pleased... and scared. - --- The Archangels... don't understand how a human can be 'opened' to the Symphony in this way. It's certainly not the way _they_ use to create Soldiers... but it does echo the creation of prophets... The seven 'chosen' Archangels can only say that they choose - or are moved to choose - a specific human, and give them the choice. Which explains why fanatics, criminals, and the insane can be found in the ranks of the imbued... ...alongside housewives, students, and blue-collar workers. The choice knows _no_ boundaries - bar Soldiers, Saints, Hellsworn and the undead. _Anyone_ else is eligible. There are also... concerns... about the effect being 'opened' to the Symphony has on the mortal mind. Novalis and Christopher, in particular, are concerned... and do their best to steer those they watch away from the path of madness. Khalid accepts it as God's will, one of the greatest sacrifices they can make. Yves... will not be drawn on the matter. Gabriel spouts prophecy about 'the fires that will show the end of days'. Dominic wonders, privately, whether their sacrifice is 'for the greater good'. And Zadkiel... ...Zadkiel weeps for those she cannot protect. And then chooses another to take their place. David has agents watching the communities they form. Blandine sees the bright dreams and ideals that shine within them...and worries that the celestials may be going too far. Eli... No one knows. No one's found him to ask yet. Janus _loves_ the shakeup they're causing - both celestially and corporeally. Jean...accepts that this is for the 'greater good', and studies their Symphonic Connection. He's noting unusual parallels to his Word. Jordi couldn't care less... unless they're fighting on behalf of those he watches. Laurence supports them, as best he can. _This_ is the Lesson he learned with Luther. Michael _also_ supports them, and defends them from Hell; they're fighting for Heaven's _cause_, whether they know it or not. And Marc wonders whether they're giving more than they get. _Hell_, on the other hand... Malphas and Kronos watch the forming imbued community, and smile. Saminga has not been seen in over a year. Kobal, strangely, is _not_ laughing... Andre's planning to corrupt as many as he can towards Lust... after all, they're still human. Asmodeus and Vapula want to get their hands on any imbued they can find - one to discover the Symphony's loopholes, the other to discover if _this_ will be his path to God. Baal is *pissed*. Belial loves the destruction. Beleth gloats at the nightmares the imbued have... and that they can become. Haagenti wants one for lunch - 'just for the taste'. Nybbas mutters about 'not _photogenic_ enouugh...' Valefor... no one knows. No one's dared ask. And Lilith? Lilith watches them. And wonders. And remembers the choice she made. - --- A Hunter character in IN should be built on 5 Forces, like an ordinary human (which, to all intents and purposes, they still are - they've just become _aware_ of the world as it really is.) Mechanics... Hmm. (Speculating wildly, here.) Conviction...hmm. This could be a toughie. I'm _tempted_ to equate it to Essence... ...but that allows a replenishment of 1 Conviction a day. It _also_ limits them to only 5 Conviction (which means they get more powerful, and crazier, faster). Hmm. I could handwave it, say that their connection to the Symphony gives them extra 'storage' for Essence, up to a maximum limit of 10 Essence... ...which they can spend on edges, 'convert' into Virtue points when it reaches 10, enables them to gamble Essence on a roll. ...but that may be overpowering them. They'd be _luckier_ than other people, succeed a bit more, but without a daily recharge, they'd regain it much slower... No daily regaining, then. No access to Songs. Or rather.. ...each creed gets access to 'special' Songs, all Corporeal. (Like the Song of Innocence, for example.) And each level of a creed's Song can be purchased with Virtue points (which limits the Songs to the imbued alone. However, the nature of their Symphonic connection would mean that they can never learn any _but_ the Songs of the creeds). Each level would have different effects (translating to the different edges), up to level 5. Leve; 6... well, no imbued would be _known_ to have achieved it... These Songs would cause no disturbance (or if there is, only the Grigori resonance would catch it...). The Virtues (Mercy/Vision/Zeal) would be treated as permanent traits, limited to a rating of 10. (Theoretically, it could go to 12, but any with a rating above that would, effectively, become a puppet of the Word they further... without concern for the Divine or Infernal interpretation.) Hmm. So Song costs... ...well, for the creed a character belongs to, it'd be 0/1/2/3/4 Virtue points for each level of the Song, 1/2/3/4 Virtue points for other creed's songs. (so no 5th level edges from another creed... which the original mechanics rule out, anyway.) At Virtue ratings of 7 or above... ...they'd get an appropriate Ethereal or Celestial disadvantage, for each level (2 at Virtue of 8, 3 at Virtue of 9, 4 at Virtue 10), related to the Word they were furthering... ...counterbalancing the 'upping' in power. The more power they'd get, the more insane they'd become (to outsiders). Hmm. Spending one Essence would grant them access to the 'sight', enabling them to see the undead (hidden or unhidden. Especially powerful ones might be blank to the sight). For ...say, an hour? Perhaps also give them the ability to recognise a celestial for what it is, if it's in a vessel. Not sure about giving them a 'secret language', though... Mental shielding... what I'd say here is that, with one point of Essence, low-level mind or emotion affecting Songs (up to levels 2 or 3) wouldn't affect them. And they'd get a bonus of their Ethereal Forces when rolling to resist a resonance... To be honest, I think these mechanics are _very_ broken. I'd welcome any other suggestions. - --- Imran ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 07:23:14 -0000 From: "I. Inayat" Subject: IN> Hunter>IN: Intro Right... Okay, so I've split my Hunter>IN conversion into two parts. One's yet another background, the other is a collection of my (seriously broken) scribblings on surface mechanics. (Virtues, Conviction, buying edges, the sight, derangements...) Feel free to deconstruct. (Why a straight conversion? Because... well, umm, they were the two systems I was most familiar with, and, well... I've _also_ learned that doing a conversion is _not_ something I'm good at... Although, if I was feeling particularly silly, I could try translating them both into BESM... In Anime meets Zombie Hunter X... hmmm...) PS: I _must_ be in a silly mood today; I'm actually trying to work out how to slot 'Doctor Who' (UK SF TV series. Mysterious human-looking alien who travels through space and time in a time machine that's a) bigger on the inside than on the outside, and b) stuck in the form of a 1960s British Police Telephone Box...) into IN... _without_ making him an Ethereal. (Although the idea of an Ethereal Doctor does sound interesting...) Any suggestions? Imran ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 07:23:22 -0000 From: "I. Inayat" Subject: IN> Hunter>IN Part 2: Mechanics Scribblings A Hunter character in IN should be built on 5 Forces, like an ordinary human (which, to all intents and purposes, they still are - they've just become _aware_ of the world as it really is.) Mechanics... Hmm. (Speculating wildly, here.) Conviction...hmm. This could be a toughie. I'm _tempted_ to equate it to Essence... ...but that allows a replenishment of 1 Conviction a day. It _also_ limits them to only 5 Conviction (which means they get more powerful, and crazier, faster). Hmm. I could handwave it, say that their connection to the Symphony gives them extra 'storage' for Essence, up to a maximum limit of 10 Essence... ...which they can spend on edges, 'convert' into Virtue points when it reaches 10, enables them to gamble Essence on a roll. ...but that may be overpowering them. They'd be _luckier_ than other people, succeed a bit more, but without a daily recharge, they'd regain it much slower... No daily regaining, then. No access to Songs. Or rather.. ...each creed gets access to 'special' Songs, all Corporeal. (Like the Song of Innocence, for example.) And each level of a creed's Song can be purchased with Virtue points (which limits the Songs to the imbued alone. However, the nature of their Symphonic connection would mean that they can never learn any _but_ the Songs of the creeds). Each level would have different effects (translating to the different edges), up to level 5. Leve; 6... well, no imbued would be _known_ to have achieved it... These Songs would cause no disturbance (or if there is, only the Grigori resonance would catch it...). The Virtues (Mercy/Vision/Zeal) would be treated as permanent traits, limited to a rating of 10. (Theoretically, it could go to 12, but any with a rating above that would, effectively, become a puppet of the Word they further... without concern for the Divine or Infernal interpretation.) Hmm. So Song costs... ...well, for the creed a character belongs to, it'd be 0/1/2/3/4 Virtue points for each level of the Song, 1/2/3/4 Virtue points for other creed's songs. (so no 5th level edges from another creed... which the original mechanics rule out, anyway.) At Virtue ratings of 7 or above... ...they'd get an appropriate Ethereal or Celestial disadvantage, for each level (2 at Virtue of 8, 3 at Virtue of 9, 4 at Virtue 10), related to the Word they were furthering... ...counterbalancing the 'upping' in power. The more power they'd get, the more insane they'd become (to outsiders). Hmm. Spending one Essence would grant them access to the 'sight', enabling them to see the undead (hidden or unhidden. Especially powerful ones might be blank to the sight). For ...say, an hour? Perhaps also give them the ability to recognise a celestial for what it is, if it's in a vessel. Not sure about giving them a 'secret language', though... Mental shielding... what I'd say here is that, with one point of Essence, low-level mind or emotion affecting Songs (up to levels 2 or 3) wouldn't affect them. And they'd get a bonus of their Ethereal Forces when rolling to resist a resonance... To be honest, I think these mechanics are _very_ broken. I'd welcome any other suggestions. - --- Imran ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 02:00:09 -0600 From: Santiago Subject: Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... >Maurice Lane wrote: > > Song of Gibberish (Ethereal) > > >Hrm. Nice, as always, but one question comes to mind, and it's a biggie: >What exactly prevents people (who speak three or more languages, which >isn't too hard for Celestials) from doing this without the Song? I know >that I regularily communicate in a French/Japanese/bits of English >pidgin with a couple of friends (who are improving their romance >languages, whereas I find that it helps my Japanese considerably), the >result of which is almost entirely incomprehensible to some who doesn't >speak the languages. Well, what I don't see is why use this song at all. Either speak a really obscure language (such as Navajo was to the Japanese during WWII) or make one up. You can shout out your battleplans if you're speaking in Angelingo, which only the other PCs understand... - -- Santiago ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 05:02:08 -0500 From: damienw@juno.com Subject: Re: IN> Magic On Fri, 24 Nov 2000 12:32:19 +1300 "Alex Liddell" writes: > the whole thing. The Demon walks in with his NumCorp Claws or the > Malakite of Gabriel decides to mix it up. Then there is the vessel > thing. When an Angel or Demon dies it can come back and finish what > it started..... a WOD character doesn't quite have that luxury. Of the WoD, a Mage might have the best chance as written since, even with my earlier objections, a WoD Mage can do anything with a capital ANY. Potentially, anyway. They can even soulkill someone (assuming you equate Avatar with Soul, which Mage only does somewhat, and assuming Gilgul would have any effect on a celestial), which a werewolf or a vampire just ain't doing anytime soon. Hunters, OTOH, fit into In Nomine quite well with a bit of editing, and vice-versa. - --- damienw[et]juno.com "SOY! Soy makes you strong! Strength crushes enemies! SOY!" ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 04:57:50 -0500 From: damienw@juno.com Subject: Re: IN> Magic On Fri, 24 Nov 2000 11:46:10 +1300 (NZDT) Keith Bolland writes: > > Actually, I would have thought that in Mage, the game of > ultra-subjective > worldviews, it would just be possible that -both- were right. This is something I ran into during a thread on Pyramid. If you say "Mage is right, reality is subjective" then you lessen In Nomine in a way, where the angels know how things really work (mostly), having a direct connection to The Guy Upstairs. Vice-versa, if Mages "merely" alter the Symphony in a manner like that of Celestials, you lessen Mage somewhat. Sure, I can live with either outcome (and both are gameable) but it is a problem with crossovers of games that deal with real fundamental concepts of reality. - --- damienw[et]juno.com "SOY! Soy makes you strong! Strength crushes enemies! SOY!" ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 07:01:45 -0600 From: "Charles Glasgow" Subject: Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Santiago" To: Sent: Saturday, November 25, 2000 2:00 AM Subject: Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... > Well, what I don't see is why use this song at all. Either > speak a really obscure language (such as Navajo was to the Japanese > during WWII) or make one up. You can shout out your battleplans if > you're speaking in Angelingo, which only the other PCs understand... Nope. A lot of demons understand it too. And in order to speak the angelic tongue on the corporeal plane, you need to have the Vassal of War distinction. - -- Chuckg ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 00:51:32 +1100 From: "Azrael/Demigouge" Subject: Re: IN> In Nomine World of Darkness part 2 [...] > What, no Toon?* > > Or Paranoia, for that matter? Here I go, spending so > much time and trouble to write up IN: Paranoia, and it > doesn't even get a mention. Grumble grumble > grumble... I am ever so sorry I forgot Paranoia, especially after your efforts...It also needs to be in the crossover...as does anything else anyone can think of....now if only we could justify...however insanely AD&D and so forth then we could add a plethora systems...if any of us ever decide that we are bored, or insane enough to do this, then I will most definately run a campaign with it....at least for a while.... Perhaps a new "Contest" should begin, using the In Nomine system as a base insert storyline/characters/and so forth of system of your choice into In Nomine...yay! sorry about the rambling non punctuated nature of the post, i was more a steady stream of thoughts directly from my brain through the keyboard, sorry for the inconvienience. Azrael ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 12:43:25 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... At 2:00 AM -0600 11/25/00, Santiago wrote: >>Maurice Lane wrote: > >You can shout out your battleplans if you're speaking in Angelingo, >which only the other PCs understand... Not on Earth, unless you're a favored Servitor of Michael. - -- Eric Alfred Burns - Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 14:25:16 -0500 From: Jonathan Walton Subject: IN> Re: Deus Ex Machina Whoops. Just realized I made a little mistake. Vapula was originally the Demon of the ENGINE before he became Prince of Technology (NOT Demon of Steam like it says in the description). Sorry about that. Don't want to give Soldekai an opposing force twisting his Word. Look what that did to Gabby :) Later. Jonathan ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 13:00:41 -0800 (PST) From: Maurice Lane Subject: IN> IN: WoD Character The below is a character for a hypothetical IN/VtM/WtA campaign. She's meant as an NPC Big Stick, but bear in mind that _no_ Kindred or Garou is going to like meeting a Flowerchild in a dark alley. Crown of Joy is _bad_ mojo; Seraph of Flowers is worse. Mercurian of Flowers will do nasty, nasty things to your herd. Master of Peace will just be wrong. Combine it all together, and, well... :) BTW, I am deriving much quiet amusement that anyone who wishes to munchkin out in an IN/WoD crossover will be well served by playing a Servitor of Novalis. It's just so blipping _bizarre_. ;) Moe Jenny Mercurian Master of Peace Angel of Parahumans Corporeal Forces: 5 Strength: 10 Agility: 10 Ethereal Forces: 6 Intelligence:12 Precision: 12 Celestial Forces: 6 Will: 12 Perception: 12 Word-Forces: 16 Vessel: petite human female/6, Charisma +1 Skills: Detect Lies/1, Dodge/6, Fighting/6, Knowledge (parahuman culture and politics/6), Languages (Enochian/1, Garou/1), Large Weapon (sword/6), Ranged Weapon (Pistol/1, Shotgun/6, rifle/1), Savoir-Faire/1, Small Weapon/2 (stake/dagger), Tactics/1 Songs: Fire (Corporeal/3), Harmony (Ethereal/6), Healing (Corporeal/3), Might (All/3), Light (Celestial/6), Shields (all/3) Attunements: Seraph of Flowers, Mercurian of Flowers, Malakite of Flowers, Crown of Joy, Nothing But Flowers, Master of Peace, Angel of Parahumans Angel of Parahumans: 1) Jenny will recognize Kindred, Garou and whatnot on sight… even if the parahuman is attempting to block or obscure itself somehow. Note that 'normal' IN Undead will not be detected. Jenny gives this ability out as a Servitor Attunement: her Servitors must make a Perception roll, and the parahuman may resist. 2) Jenny doubles her Celestial Forces when using her Seraph of Flowers Attunement on someone in Frenzy or Rage. 3) Angelic blood is normally non-nutritious to Kindred: with a Will Roll, Jenny can either a), make it as nutritious as normal human blood, or b), cause it to boil five seconds after the vampire drinks it. She usually has it set to the latter. Special Rites: Protect an innocent from a parahuman attack. Help a parahuman snap out of Frenzy or Rage. (+2 Essence) When Jenny walks into a room, prudent Vampires, Werewolves and other assorted parahuman denizens of the World of Darkness walk out. It's not because she's lethal in a fight (although she is). It's not because she can recognize anything that isn't pure human on sight (she can). It's not even that Kindred and Lupus-type Garou have been declared to be, in the end, officially 'not-human' (although they have). No, what makes them flee is her personality. Her sweet, cheerful, happy personality. Her nauseatingly optimistic personality. She clashes horribly with the World of Darkness... and, when push comes to shove, it's the World of Darkness that comes off worse. Now, bear in mind that Jenny doesn't begrudge either Garou or Kindred the right to exist: she's actually very fond of the former (at least, the calmer ones), and recognizes that the latter don't really have many dietary options. Plus, apparently there are people out there who like having their blood drunk: Jenny thinks that's a little disgusting, but it's not her job to pass judgement on the sex lives of consenting adults of any species. Her job is to make sure that parahumans don't randomly eviscerate, drain, rape or drive insane innocent people. Jenny doesn't like that sort of thing at all, and will demonstrate such dislike whenever it happens. In combat, Jenny is a nightmare. Unfortunately for denizens of the World of Darkness, she can shut down the average opponent's Frenzy or Rage in a second, and keep it shut down while she decides whether the parahuman's crossed over the line. If it has... well, that's a pity. Mom doesn't like it when her angels kill sentient mortals, but she likes even less having to get reports of maternity wards filled with drained babies. While ripping apart some depraved Tzimisce or Black Spiral Dancer isn't, strictly speaking, dissonant for her (see above ruling), it does bother her a lot: however, it's a regrettably necessary part of her job. After a particularly rough cleansing, she'll occasionally retreat to a bar to get a drink, a slight scowl on her face. When they see her in that state, parahumans _run_ out of the room. ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Everything else (not that there is, right now): http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/main.html Last updated 9/5/00 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 15:26:36 -0600 From: Santiago Subject: Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... > > Well, what I don't see is why use this song at all. Either > > speak a really obscure language (such as Navajo was to the Japanese > > during WWII) or make one up. You can shout out your battleplans if > > you're speaking in Angelingo, which only the other PCs understand... > >Nope. A lot of demons understand it too. And in order to speak the angelic >tongue on the corporeal plane, you need to have the Vassal of War >distinction. No, you're thinking of the Angelic Celestial Tongue. I'm talking about Angelingo, a new language the PCs made up a few months back, much the way people have done with Esperanto and Klingon. - -- Santiago ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 15:31:45 -0600 From: "Charles Glasgow" Subject: Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Santiago" To: Sent: Saturday, November 25, 2000 3:26 PM Subject: Re: IN> Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp, Wahnp Wahnp... [snip] > >Nope. A lot of demons understand it too. And in order to speak the angelic > >tongue on the corporeal plane, you need to have the Vassal of War > >distinction. > > No, you're thinking of the Angelic Celestial Tongue. I'm > talking about Angelingo, a new language the PCs made up a few months > back, much the way people have done with Esperanto and Klingon. Is this just a few code words, or an entire synthetic language? If the latter, how fortunate for them that a player took the appropriate Knowledge skills to actually create an entire new language. Plus, unless the party restricts it only to themselves (as opposed to making it the new Heaven-wide gimmick), Hell will learn the newest set of code words in a couple of decades anyway -- when the next angel Falls. I wonder how many prior versions of Angelingo have been made obsolete? It's like any other branch of cryptography -- you make a code, they break/steal it, you make another it, they get that, you make another one... the Red Queen's racetrack... - -- Chuckg ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 14:51:58 -0800 (PST) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> It's not my fault. Really. Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 12:56:45 -0800 (PST)From: Peter Eng Subject: IN> It's not my fault. Really. >There's no solid numbers on him, but the idea amused >me... >Gulbol >Balseraph of Factions >Knight of Deception, Demon of Refusing Credit and >Avoiding Blame I liked this one (especially the pun: I have a goodbad habit of punnish celestial names). You should add the mechanics... :) Moe ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Everything else (not that there is, right now): http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/main.html Last updated 9/5/00 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 14:58:26 -0800 (PST) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> "No! You fool! That's the Time Eraser Button!" Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 21:21:26 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> "No! You fool! That's the Time Eraser Button!" >But Lilith wouldn't be working on consignment any >more. Oh no. That was when favors and children were >her stock in trade. Now that Hell itself *depends* on >her... then everything is strictly Cash On Delivery. >You want the Word of America -- you have to do her >something *first.* And if two Demons want it -- then >whoever does it before the other gets the Word. > >Of course, Princes can do so much *more* for Lilith, >so of course the Words they Sponsor will be worth so >much more. But then again, no Prince will *keep* his >Word and Principality without her, so.... God, _there's_ a rock and a hard place for you: die a lingering death, or take your Word back from a _talking_ _monkey_ (albeit the most souped-up talking monkey of All Time, but I suspect that no Prince ever forgets, deep down, that Lilith's a mere _human_, at the end). And the third option? Redeem, and admit that God was right all along. This is practically a case study for cognitive dissonance. I _love_ it. :) Moe ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Everything else (not that there is, right now): http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/main.html Last updated 9/5/00 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 00:24:01 -0000 From: "rossk" Subject: IN> new to the list, the game and all hi there listmembers. i just bought a new copy of in nomine (my first being donated as a going away present, long story) and got up to the point in characters where it mentions "words". i understand the concept but do players get to choose their own? or are the handed out like rewards? and has anyone converted the movie "dogma" into a story yet? RossK any rebukes, rebuttals, reprises, replies or responses you want off net, mail to rossk@ukonline.co.uk i might even care. "The elephant is a pretty bird, it flits from bough to bough, and makes its nest in a rhubarb tree, and whistles like a cow" - --Gabriel the Toad ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1939 ******************************** The material here is (C) 2000 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.