From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Wed Jun 14 22:37:27 2000 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA01107 for ; Wed, 14 Jun 2000 22:37:27 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id WAA24903 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Wed, 14 Jun 2000 22:35:49 -0500 Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 22:35:49 -0500 Message-Id: <200006150335.WAA24903@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1677 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Wednesday, June 14 2000 Volume 01 : Number 1677 In this digest: IN> Can Superiors hear Disturbances in the Symphony? Re: IN> Prehistoric In Nomine Re: IN> Can Superiors hear Disturbances in the Symphony? IN> Disturbance and "Home" Realms IN> Kobal and the Magic Uriel IN> Zoroastrianism IN> Zoroastrianism Re: IN> Can Superiors hear Disturbances in the Symphony? Re: IN> Adventure Plot Thingy II. Re: IN> Adventure Plot Thingy II. Re: IN> Dominic and Killing Re: IN> Adventure Plot Thingy II. Re: IN> Disturbance and "Home" Realms IN> A Discord for Nybassians Re: IN> A Discord for Nybassians Re: IN> Endgame: The Beginning of the End Re: IN> Endgame: The Beginning of the End Re: IN> Endgame: The Beginning of the End Re: IN> Endgame: The Beginning of the End Re: IN> Disturbance and "Home" Realms Re: IN> A Discord for Nybassians IN> The Last Temptation of Yves part II ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 15:03:10 -0400 From: "Charles Phipps" Subject: IN> Can Superiors hear Disturbances in the Symphony? With all this disturbance talk I was curious about a fact that I use in my campaigns to alittle affect-Basically Superiors up in Heaven can hear disturbances on the mortal world and send their folk to investigate. Superiors having the senses they do thus can track the sound of demonic or angellic explosians and send folk to investigate. However they have better things to do with thier time. In my campaign I'm considering having demons and angelic renegades dissonance audible in Heaven so that basically the Malakim in Black can show up if it's persistant (meaning the demons have a base) or loud enough (it's something that needs to be dealt with *NOW*) - -Charlemagne ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 15:26:14 -0400 From: Marc Bowden Subject: Re: IN> Prehistoric In Nomine - --On Wed, Jun 14, 2000 15:06 -0400 Walter Milliken wrote: > At 11:25 -0400 6/14/00, Marc Bowden wrote: >> Have you (or anyone else) seen a movie called "Girlfriend from >> Hell"? There's a character in the movie called Chaser, who can pull >> literally *anything* out of his overcoat - provided it's just an >> incidental prop. I've been wondering lately what that would cost in >> IN terms... > > Also known as the "Bag of Many Things" schtick in Toon. (From Felix > the Cat, I've always assumed.) A stock tradition in animation; I've > noticed it even in Japanese anime, but there it tends to be limited > to a single item or type of item. (Anime girls often have access to > Giant Mallets from Other Dimensions, without any other special > powers. And Genma Saotome (in Ranma 1/2) continues the tradition of > Wile E. Coyote, of pulling appropriate signage out of thin air, since > he's otherwise mute.) > > Bringing this back to IN a bit, I've sometimes thought about having a > Creation attunement to do this, somewhat like Abracadabra, but with > the ability to make more complex objects. I've actually had an NPC > Creationer use Transubstantiation to make a driver's license (it's > basically all organic materials, right? OK, so it's paper and > plastics, not dead fish, but creative use of attunements ought to > apply....). That may be have been a bad idea, though.... > Well, let me explain a bit how I, personally, would use it. I'm very fond of making characters with unusual powers - and then never actually using those powers the way the manufacturer intended. Case in point: my shaowrun character has a ridiculous strength attribute for an unassuming human. Now, a munchkin might have a field day with this.... I use it as a recurring sight gag. No, really, think about it. Sure, I can open any jar in creation and have a casual lift of about 600#, but my *mass* is roughly the same - and he keeps forgetting about the augmentation (traumatic surgery - different story). I love doing things like, during a particularly intense interrogation of a metatype much larger than me, I grab his collar in one hand, yank...and do an involuntary chin-up. Or sure, I'm strong enough to catch the troll's fist, however, it's bigger than my *head* and backed by more mass than I have.... Today, we're teaching detectives how to fly... The Amazing Multispacial Dreamcoat would get used the same way. Never be befret of a pen again. Or a paperclip. Or a can of lite beer. In the same unsettling way that Tony Shalhoub in Galaxy Quest *always* had something to munch on, never be without a packet of crisps, or one of those cheese-and-cracker things. Pulling anything *useful* out (your keys, the treasure of the sierra madre) wouldn't be in character, of course. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 15:44:19 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Can Superiors hear Disturbances in the Symphony? At 3:03 PM -0400 6/14/00, Charles Phipps wrote: >With all this disturbance talk I was curious about a fact that I use in my >campaigns to alittle affect-Basically Superiors up in Heaven can hear >disturbances on the mortal world and send their folk to investigate. It's not canon, but it's as good a reason as any for people to want to keep their heads down. I'm not sure why an Outcast/Renegade would show up any more clearly than any other celestial's disturbance, though. - --Beth, catching up as she can, typing with a baby (iolanthe) in her lap. But now with a computer desk! Vapitalizatoin and spelling still difficult, typing w/ 1 hand (and often a wigglebaby in the other). ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 15:55:49 EDT From: Daedalus3D@aol.com Subject: IN> Disturbance and "Home" Realms Along the lines of the Ethereal disturbance question: Do Celestials create a disturbance when spending essence/destroying things in the Celestial realm? Humans don't in the Corporeal realm, so I was wondering if each group (Celestials, Ethereals, Corporeals) didn't make a disturbance in their own realm. If Celestials do make disturbances in their own realms (and Ethereals too), it might indicate that Celestials (and Ethereals) are not a true part of the Symphony at all, since their alien actions disturb it. Thoughts? Daedalus ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 16:20:59 -0400 From: "Charles Phipps" Subject: IN> Kobal and the Magic Uriel >How do angels get to Hell? Where do they appear when they get there? Could >they use a tether, and if so, is this wise? The way I rule the rule, angels and demons can use heavingly and demonic tethers as can Ethereals but this goes compeletely against Cannon. However I like the look and feel of there being a special spot in the library only Celestials and Ethereals can see that leads in Yves library. >What happens to angels in Hell? I heard they generated dissonance every so >often... Nope. According to cannon angels see Hell for exactly as it is and don't get any more dissonance for being in it. Angels for lack of a better term know that everyone happy in hell is deluding themselves they aren't suffering just as much as the torture victems. In Heaven Demons suffer disonance as they hear the overwhelming power of God's love-basically it sucks to be mad against God and that's really the whole point of the war. >In Hell, you can change your Celestial appearance, right? Not without an artifact or attunement. I considered allowing vessels in heaven despite cannon as well but figure they just cause disturbance ala angels in the humans land. >Creative talents wanted! If anyone can flesh the following out, I'd >appreciate it. Always willing to help. >Other than that, I'd like more details into his mentality, what he's doing now, and how the players can >find him and learn why he is important. Basically a mad serpent flowing about with an animal's mind or mummbling madness in an alleyway eating from the garbage of Haagenti and the occasional lusty soul....depending on the guy's former stature I'd say he's either extremely paranoid/aggressive, fearful as hell, or mumbling blasphemies to himslef like Rain Man "I got the joke, I got the joke, I got the joke..." On some level I think he might actually trust angels as he remembers his time in heaven before the rebellion probably clearer-as a Balseraph getting mind stripped has a serious problem with your capacity for self delusions-in other words he's likely to be pretty disonant as well. The Malakim though will likely terrify him even worse from memories of the fall mixed with the Uriel aspect of Kobal's joke. (Malakim during the Fall were like the Colonel Kurtz's of the Heaven's troops) All in all if he's joyous he may actually start recovering his word and be ripe for redemption-recovering his sanity from the true symphony as well. Problem being no doubt Kronos is looking for his VERY old friend and associate with a few loaned Calabim in Black and maybe a Balseraph Knight of the Game loaned from Asmodeus (they do track renegades well-and Kronos may wonder whether his old pal is out now) >And since this entity can get into Heaven, and can >grant that ability to those who serve it, Kobal has dreamed up the hilarious >idea of having his Pseudo-Uriel lead a charge of Ethereals into Blandine's >tower. This might be a disturbing scene for the PCs to catch wind of. Beleth sends an invitation to the Old Gods at Kobal's behalf before anonymous letters arrive simarily towards The Far Marches and a Tsallydam camp. Before war arrives Uriel arrives in all the pomp and ceremony of how people imagined the Messiah to come...proclaiming a misson from God. "I have returned children of Heaven and Earth's dreams because she/he has spoken to me to say that Heaven has become corrupted....weakened by lacking purity and strength of arms necessary to destroy the forces of hell and defying her will every bit as much. My crusade showed her I was fitting to be the Strong. I have wronged you by destroying your loved ones but now I offer restitution....she/he has spoken to me calling for the destruction of heaven...then Hell...then the establishment of a new order with you as the new Archangels and I as the Lord thy God of this universe." (perhaps some genocidal talk of the human race and sewing the earth with a better seed-you know the drill-Kobal is nothing if not dramatic-they'll get slaughtered but give the PCs something to fear). Beleth gets to imprison Baladine out of all this if the Tower is taken. Sound good? - -Charlemagne ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 22:24:50 +0100 From: "Christopher Lee" Subject: IN> Zoroastrianism Hi folks, I have been thinking rather too much recently and I have hit upon another topic of possible interest. I was wondering what the exact position of Zoroastrianism is in the In Nomine universe. David mentions it in the GMG, but as it is minor nowadays it gets an understandably short mention. I was thinking that as a major world religion (albeit now largely extinct) and a fundamental source for Judaeo-Christian-Moslem thought and, vitally for In Nomine, ideas about angels and demons, it might have attracted a following of angels. I wondered what people might think of the idea of a Zoroastrian archangel? Perhaps with a few followers. I thought that Truth might be appropriate, since the central concept of Zoroastrianism is the choice between Truth (Ashi/Asha/Asa) and Lie (Drug/Druj). This would also allow said archangel to branch out and do other things whilst remaining a central staunch advocate of the religion. Chris Lee ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 22:24:50 +0100 From: "Christopher Lee" Subject: IN> Zoroastrianism Hi folks, I have been thinking rather too much recently and I have hit upon another topic of possible interest. I was wondering what the exact position of Zoroastrianism is in the In Nomine universe. David mentions it in the GMG, but as it is minor nowadays it gets an understandably short mention. I was thinking that as a major world religion (albeit now largely extinct) and a fundamental source for Judaeo-Christian-Moslem thought and, vitally for In Nomine, ideas about angels and demons, it might have attracted a following of angels. I wondered what people might think of the idea of a Zoroastrian archangel? Perhaps with a few followers. I thought that Truth might be appropriate, since the central concept of Zoroastrianism is the choice between Truth (Ashi/Asha/Asa) and Lie (Drug/Druj). This would also allow said archangel to branch out and do other things whilst remaining a central staunch advocate of the religion. Chris Lee ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 17:32:15 -0400 From: Walter Milliken Subject: Re: IN> Can Superiors hear Disturbances in the Symphony? At 15:03 -0400 6/14/00, Charles Phipps wrote: >With all this disturbance talk I was curious about a fact that I use in my >campaigns to alittle affect-Basically Superiors up in Heaven can hear >disturbances on the mortal world and send their folk to investigate. Or the Superiors may simply have a manifestation around somewhere in the general vicinity (i.e., on the same continent), and used that as their "ears". I prefer that to giving them the ability to hear things cross-realm. And don't forget that Superiors have whole organizations on Earth -- it might have just been a report from a reliever/demonling assigned to the area as a "listening post". Or any other servitor who either didn't have time to deal with it, or was otherwise unequipped to (wrong type of vessel, Role-related problems, wrong skill set). I prefer this approach, since it also puts a friendly contact NPC in the area for the PCs to talk to. (Aka "GM mouthpiece" aka "redshirt"....) For angels, a reliever is the easiest choice -- give it an unremarkable animal vessel (like a stray cat). For demons, you can do the same with a demonling, or have a 7-Force demon with a human vessel and minor Role. (A Djinn is the best choice -- it's not likely to get into trouble on its own, and, unlike an Impudite, unlikely to have any useful abilities beyond leading them to the trouble.) Neither is likely to upstage the PCs, or provide more than minimal help. (The NPC can also claim that its orders are to listen and report, not investigate or get into battles -- and they can be specialized for that task.) >In my campaign I'm considering having demons and angelic renegades >dissonance audible in Heaven so that basically the Malakim in Black can show >up if it's persistant (meaning the demons have a base) or loud enough (it's >something that needs to be dealt with *NOW*) I don't think you really need to make the lives of Outcasts and Renegades any harder than it is -- there are already plenty of ways to spot them, unless they *really* keep their heads down. (In which case they're not much of a problem anyone cares about, except Judgment and the Game. And they have people specialized in spotting dissonant types.) - ---Walter ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 17:32:20 -0400 From: Walter Milliken Subject: Re: IN> Adventure Plot Thingy II. At 15:45 -0400 6/14/00, Earl Wajenberg wrote: >ben wrote: >> So I am soliciting a personality for Putrukiel (such as it is) > >Which isn't much. With no Corporeal or Ethereal Forces, there isn't >much left to it but will and perception. I'd be inclined to >treat it as permanently "punch drunk" from the force-stripping. >Can't think straight, can't remember clearly, can't DO anything >being weak as a kitten and totally clumsy. On the contrary, in the celestial realm, it would be fairly strong, since it has a normal demon's Celestial Forces, and that grants "strength" and "agility" in the celestial realm. It would be hopeless on Earth, though. But with no Corp. Forces, it can't have a vessel, so that's a moot point. > I picture a writhing >worm, reacting emotionally and without consideration to whatever >is in the immediate environment. What remains is to decide what >Putrukiel liked, feared, or hated. That part seems reasonable. But it's a *strong* and *agile* worm, reacting without thought. All it needs is a manager.... - ---Walter ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 17:32:12 -0400 From: Walter Milliken Subject: Re: IN> Adventure Plot Thingy II. At 14:19 -0400 6/14/00, ben wrote: >How do angels get to Hell? a) Follow a demon down or b) use an infernal Tether are about the only options I can think of at the moment. A Superior *might* be able to send them, but that's iffy, and most Superiors probably wouldn't do it, anyway. In my campaign, this is forbidden by the Seraphim Council, without specific permission from them. (This is primarily to keep Malakim from chasing demons to Hell to continue a celestial combat.) > Where do they appear when they get there? a) Next to the demon's Heart, with the demon (and whatever forces are guarding the Heart area...). b) At the infernal locus of the Tether. Along with whatever guardians the Tether has on call, and probably a *very* annoyed Seneschal -- who has access to a *lot* of Essence in this sort of emergency, usually (see the L.Castellorum)). > Could >they use a tether, and if so, is this wise? Yes, and no. The only except might be a "wild" Tether (see the L.Castellorum again), where the infernal end isn't anchored, so there won't necessarily be anyone right there guarding the Tether. There also won't be a Seneschal. They could also probably make a deal with Lilith to use one of the Free Lilim Guild Hall Tethers (I'd presume her Tethers terminate there). But it would be *very* expensive -- unless the angel had left Lilith a loophole to sell the angel to Andrealphus (or Baal, or any other Prince who might like to snatch an angel in Hell). Either way, it's probably still not wise.... >What happens to angels in Hell? I heard they generated dissonance every so >often... I don't recall that; I do seem to recall that they don't regenerate Essence while there. But there are a lot of ways for angels to get dissonant in Hell -- and plenty of people to help them do so.... >In Hell, you can change your Celestial appearance, right? Not really, no. They're still going to be recognizable. I think there may be a secret Song in the L.Canticorum that can hide a celestial's true nature in the celestial realms, but I'm not sure. And it's a *secret* Song, if so. >------- > >Creative talents wanted! If anyone can flesh the following out, I'd >appreciate it. > >I plan to have the angels go to Hell to find Putrukiel, a Balseraph of >Kronos. Putrukiel has lost all but his Celestial forces and is wandering >around Shal-Mari; the angels are going to try to find him knowing nothing >but his name. Frankly, this is a *really* iffy job for angels, in canon. They can't hide their nature in Hell, and they're going to get spotted, and picked up by the Game or War fairly quickly. Or Andre will drop by to "recruit" them - -- angels are a rare novelty, and a big draw, in his brothels.... If your goal is to give the PCs a tour of Hell, then you either have to deviate from canon significantly, or find some way to get them there without exposing them as angels. A Song to mask their natures (as I mentioned above) is one possiblity, but that's a very dangerous thing to let loose in a canon campaign. An artifact with such a Song is maybe a better choice. Another option would be some kind of Song or artifact that let them "hitch a ride" with a demon, much like a Shedite with a human host. It would be a GM call whether such a "celestial possession" would be noticable in celestial form. Again, such a Song would be a dangerous thing to have loose in a campaign. A variant of the above might be the Celestial Song of Unity (L.Canticorum), which, if I'm remembering it right, ought to be able to temporarily merge some angels with a demon as a composite entity similar to a Kyrio. Such a being *might* be able to manifest only the demon's celestial form in Hell; I don't recall what the Song says about celestial forms. But you could probably GM-fiat an appropriate variant of it, at least. Doing this could be all kinds of fun for the GM -- the Song has a number of drawbacks. And merging angels with a demon would probably create some unique problems of its own.... (Like hitting the angels with a point of dissonance when the Song ends, from too-close linkage to a demonic mindset. And the demon trying to "drive". Not to mention the likely player squabbles about what to do next with the composite entity.) You could either provide a captive demon as a participant, or force the players to go acquire a likely candidate. (A Free Lilim might go for it, if you paid her enough.) > He used to be the Angel of Joy and rebelled with Kobal, whom >he served until Kronos arrived in Hell. Other than that, I'd like more >details into his mentality, what he's doing now, and how the players can >find him and learn why he is important. > >(He's important because his Balseraph of Kronos attunement -- which Kobal >stole when he force-stripped him -- is letting Kobal make an entity which >appears to be an angel.) I'm not sure I'd want to allow Princes to steal each others' attunements that way -- otherwise they'd be kidnapping Servitors of other DPs all the time for that purpose. As far as masquerading as an angel, if the PCs can masquerade as demons in Hell somehow, then it ought to be equally easy for a demon to masquerade as an angel (except for the Light of Heaven problem -- there's no equivalent to that with angels in Hell). >So I am soliciting a personality for Putrukiel (such as it is), Well, if it's only got Cel. Forces, it's got to be a demonling now, more or less. (Probably one looking like a small Balseraph, though.) With no Ethereal Forces, it's going to be easily manipulated by others, but it will be strong (by demonling standards) if it still has most of its celestial Forces, so think "big, tough, but pretty stupid, gang member", in a demonling gang roving Shal Mari. > and an >adventure on how angels in Hell can find him and find out what is going on >with him. All they have is a name. Well, if you go with the "Lilim-merger" concept, a Free Lilim would have some contacts in Shal Mari they could start with. Finding a specific demonling is going to be a pain, though, even with contacts. The best bet would be to look for some Lilim who specialized in hooking demonlings ("demon futures"), and get her to ask around the demonling gangs for someone fitting the description. Of course, if they don't know he's stripped down to demonling status, that will make things *much* harder. The logical place to start would be Kronos' Principality, and the records kept there. Again, a Free Lilim might have contacts. (Or they could try to force her to promise a favor in return for information from someone in the Archives.) They could try to get a Theft Servitor to steal (or copy) the records on demons of that name. Or they might just rummage around in the Archives on their own (which would keep them busy for a few years). They could also have the Free Lilim Guild Hall contract records checked, to see if he was ever involved in a deal brokered there. (That will cost, of course.) If they did that, they might be able to find a Lilim who'd dealt with him, and might know something about him. Might even be able to recognize him in his current state, if she knew him well enough. If you need to make things easy on the PCs, you could even have her remember running into the demonling-version in Shal Mari a few weeks ago. But demonlings move around a lot there. (Lots of turnover, you know....) If you want to be really annoying with the demonling stuff, Elizabeth wrote a "demonling hunt" adventure seed for Shal Mari in Superiors 2 (I think it is). It would provide plenty of distraction and additional problems, if you need to annoy the PCs some more. > The party is made up of a Malakite of >Fire, a Malakite of Wind, and an Ofanite of Fire. Occasionally they have a >Cherub of the Sword with them, too. Oooh! Merging that lot with a Lilim using Cel. Unity would be *loads* of fun! > By giving Putrukiel's forces -- and a >few Ethereal forces stolen from a real Tsayadim -- to the Pseudo-Uriel >dreamshade, he's managed to create an entity that is almost a perfect >duplicate of Uriel. Mmmm... more canon problems here, I think -- I'm pretty sure the Bal of Kronos attunement still leaves them looking like a Bal in celestial form, at least partly. He *could* give the fake Uriel the Malakite resonance that way, though. (Assuming Superiors can hijack attunements that way at all.) - ---Walter ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 16:39:13 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Dominic and Killing From: "Charles Phipps" > > >stopped. So it's a case of killing one hellbound soul, or letting him be > >responsible for the damnation of many others, and there isn't always a > >quick, reasonable alternative. > > While I can see it as possibly being done on Khalid, Laurence, Michael's > part (basically Holy Assaisins working for the CIA, Isareli governments, > MI6, Vatican etc etc etc) to kill soldiers of Hell or the mortal vessels of > Balseraphs etc After watching "The Boondock Saints," I've started getting some really twisted ideas along these lines. I plan on posting them to the list within th enext day or so, in serial fashion (because I suspect I'll be taking more than the suggested 10k limit by the time I'm done...) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 18:24:56 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Adventure Plot Thingy II. At 12:19 PM -0600 6/14/00, ben wrote: >------- > >How do angels get to Hell? Follow a demon, go down a Tether, or get dragged down via a relic or by a Superior's Will. > Where do they appear when they get there? By the demon they followed, at the bottom of the Tether, by the demon/relic that dragged them, or wherever the Superior wishes them. Respectively. > Could they use a tether, and if so, is this wise? Yes, and no. O:> Seneschals of demonic Tethers tend to object. >What happens to angels in Hell? I heard they generated dissonance every so >often... Check out either H&H, or the errata for same. Though the errata mostly deals with demons in Heaven. >In Hell, you can change your Celestial appearance, right? No. Not in canon. The entertaining scenes in Fiat notwithstanding. O:> If you want this to be feasible, though, I would use the Fiat models: http://orleans.pave-france.org/~maya/week2/d2/LOG15B3.html http://orleans.pave-france.org/~maya/week2/d3/LOG16A1A.html http://orleans.pave-france.org/~maya/week2/d3/LOG16A1B.html http://orleans.pave-france.org/~maya/week2/d3/LOG16B3.html http://orleans.pave-france.org/~maya/week2/d3/LOG16C1.html >------- >So I am soliciting a personality for Putrukiel (such as it is), and an >adventure on how angels in Hell can find him and find out what is going on >with him. I would suggest two references... http://www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/articles/INChar/Angels/Seraph.Birdy.html and http://www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/articles/fiction/maya/birdy.html Both are, of course, non-canon fluff -- but upon scanning Birdy again, I don't see any reason not to think that he's close 'nuff. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 18:26:54 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Disturbance and "Home" Realms At 3:55 PM -0400 6/14/00, Daedalus3D@aol.com wrote: >Along the lines of the Ethereal disturbance question: > >Do Celestials create a disturbance when spending essence/destroying things in >the Celestial realm? See the errata page for Heaven & Hell. O:> (www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/errata) - --Beth, catching up as she can, typing with a baby (iolanthe) in her lap. But now with a computer desk! Vapitalizatoin and spelling still difficult, typing w/ 1 hand (and often a wigglebaby in the other). ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 18:48:08 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> A Discord for Nybassians PhotoEyes (Corporeal) This Discord afflicts Nybassians, almost exclusively. Whenever the demon uses its resonance, or any Band or Servitor Attunement the GM deems appropriate, its irises... contract, like a camera. Ka-click. This gives observers a Perception roll to notice, increased by the level of the Discord. At level 1, the effect is relatively subtle -- the iris contracts around the pupil, with a faint "inward spiral" motion that an onlooker may discount. Around level 3, the effect is noticably like a camera's shutter. At level 6, the iris expands to take over the entire eye, "snapshots," and returns to normal. Some beings believe that Nybbas himself suffers from this Discord, though explaining _why_ this would be the case is usually difficult. [This Discord Brought To You By Random Particles Of Inspiration.] - --Beth, catching up as she can, typing with a baby (iolanthe) in her lap. But now with a computer desk! Vapitalizatoin and spelling still difficult, typing w/ 1 hand (and often a wigglebaby in the other). ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 17:13:13 -0700 From: Ryan Elias Subject: Re: IN> A Discord for Nybassians Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > PhotoEyes (Corporeal) ^_^ Hrmmm. A bit lenient for a full three points/level, but that's easy enough to fix... It's a shame that there isn't an Archangel this is really appropriate for, since angelic resonances are the perception based ones (I'm ambivalent about Calabim eyes going kaclick just before things blow up ^_^). Perhaps if the exact manifestation of this discord varied according to to the demonic band? Anyways, I like. -Ryan ------------------------------ Date: 14 Jun 2000 17:49:49 -0700 From: Casca Subject: Re: IN> Endgame: The Beginning of the End > Eric, i asked you to post it, to me and select others, or to the I know. This made the silence more jarring. > list. you've an impressive track-record with your In Nomine stuff, > and i've hardly been online of late, so i both didn't think you > needed to hear how much i like the possibilities of this campaign I like getting response back on my work. Constructive criticism is best, but compliments are good too. I mean, you know your fiancee loves you, but don't you enjoy hearing her say it anyway? Same thing with me and my writing. > as well as the fact that i didn't have much time to email you. yes, > i liked the beginning of Endgame. i'm eager to see more. You and two others. - -- Casca "...I saw the Lord seated on a throne, high and exalted, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above Him were seraphs, each with six wings: with two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they were flying...At the sound of their voices the doorposts and thresholds shook, and the temple was filled with smoke." -- Isaiah 6:2,4 _______________________________________________________ Are you a Techie? Get Your Free Tech Email Address Now! Many to choose from! Visit http://www.TechEmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 21:32:51 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Endgame: The Beginning of the End At 5:49 PM -0700 6/14/00, Casca wrote: > > > as well as the fact that i didn't have much time to email you. yes, >> i liked the beginning of Endgame. i'm eager to see more. > >You and two others. Nah -- more than two. It's just the nature of the net that huge responses are rare and far between. (Hm. Another Eric. That makes four or so. The Conspiracy of Erics has a strong In Nomine faction.) - -- Eric Alfred Burns | in-sabre@annotations.com | Writer - Manager - IT Type - Poet Boy - In Nomine Freelancer ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 21:41:30 -0500 From: David Edelstein Subject: Re: IN> Endgame: The Beginning of the End Casca wrote: > I like getting response back on my work. Constructive criticism is > best, but compliments are good too. I mean, you know your fiancee > loves you, but don't you enjoy hearing her say it anyway? Same thing > with me and my writing. But you haven't really earned your chops as a writer until someone flames your work and tells you how much you suck. ;) - -David (and fishing for praise is cheesy) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 21:33:39 -0500 From: "Kiara S. Legner" Subject: Re: IN> Endgame: The Beginning of the End >>You and two others. And two more from my house. It's great, and I'm really looking forward to the rest of it. Ki ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 23:28:54 -0400 From: Walter Milliken Subject: Re: IN> Disturbance and "Home" Realms At 15:55 -0400 6/14/00, Daedalus3D@aol.com wrote: >Do Celestials create a disturbance when spending essence/destroying things in >the Celestial realm? I believe the answer is no, at least for destroying things. *Conscious* Essence expenditure always causes disturbance, I'd think, since humans do cause disturbance that way in the corporeal. (Unwitting Essence expenditure is something else again.) > Humans don't in the Corporeal realm, so I was wondering >if each group (Celestials, Ethereals, Corporeals) didn't make a disturbance >in their own realm. I believe that Ethereals don't make disturbance by messing with their own realm, but *do* cause disturbance normally if they interfere with human dreamscapes. (I think this is in canon somewhere.) I don't know about Ethereals in their own realm, but outside their own domain -- it seems to me that this *might* subject them to the "outsiders cause disturbance" rule. If I recall correctly, celestials *do* cause disturbance in the Marches generally >If Celestials do make disturbances in their own realms (and Ethereals too), >it might indicate that Celestials (and Ethereals) are not a true part of the >Symphony at all, since their alien actions disturb it. > >Thoughts? I believe both are considered part of the Symphony as a whole, but not the corporeal realm (and celestials aren't part of the Marches, either). There are two possible rules of thumb, which lead to roughly the same conclusions: - "outsiders" cause disturbance - interfering with humans/the human realm causes disturbance Since the Marches and their inhabitants are, in large part, creations of humans, interference in the Marches is indirectly interference with humans. But I think this argument is weaker than the "outsiders" one. Basically that simply states "unnatural things cause disturbance." - ---Walter ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 23:33:34 -0400 From: Walter Milliken Subject: Re: IN> A Discord for Nybassians At 20:13 -0400 6/14/00, Ryan Elias wrote: >Elizabeth McCoy wrote: >> PhotoEyes (Corporeal) >It's a shame that there isn't an Archangel this is really appropriate >for, since angelic resonances are the perception based ones (I'm >ambivalent about Calabim eyes going kaclick just before things blow up >^_^). Maybe his calabim get "laser eyes" instead -- after all, it's a standard schtick in the media. Or maybe they just have to squint at things real hard to use their resonance. ("Get SFX to work on this Calabite, stat!") - ---Walter ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 23:28:19 -0400 From: "Charles Phipps" Subject: IN> The Last Temptation of Yves part II Hey I'm chronicalling sorting-you know where you list the various things you want to include in a chronicle and how you want it to go. Well I was thinking I could share my ideas with you and maybe get some comments while perhaps sharing an idea you will enjoy (or two)... FYI: The Last Temptation of Yves is a chronicle based on the idea that Yves is becomming increasingly dissonant since Lucifer spoke to him after a tragic loss of his first creation from the Symphony. Selecting champions to prove to him of humanity and angelic virtue (basically that God's plan is not a failure and by proxy himself)...they go off to do it. Returning in a year and a day before Dominic is forced to bring his master before trial....A trial no one in heaven will miss. Idea 1: The New Metatron While I'm not sure this idea fits in with the Last Temptation of Yves, it basically revolves around a seraph servitor who is being hunted by Dominic for his heretical dissonance. Basically he speaks things as absolute truth no seraph knows about God, Jesus, and ummmmm the Heaveningly nobility. He's also growing 2 new heads on his Celestial form and wings of fire. The truth of the matter is that Dominic has judged the system completely wrong-the seraph has been selected for his wisdom, love of humanity, and gentleness mixed with boundless courage as the new mouthpiece of God in the world today. The Three Seraph heads speak each for a face of the Trinity and the fiery wings are just for effect... He will ascend to archangel status if he is allowed to reach it but Dominic's Inquisitors have orders to destroy him completely-he cannot be allowed to "Fall" for his heresay. I was thinking Gabrielle might herald his comming but being she's insane.... Note: I was thinking this might work for thsoe particularly outspoken Seraph in the party but it seems too monolithic to have done to him. Still he is the perfect description of what I did above and what I described...just he's also forgetful. Idea 2: The Storms in Heaven A terrible storm is wracking Heaven that is as it's supposed to be fairly perfect weather up there-fairly unusual by heavenly standards. basically the Superiors for their own reasons (but mostly summarized as-damnit we LIVE HERE) are trying to get everyone on their toes to figure out what exactly is causing it. I'm thinking that is might actually be the Dissonance of a Superior mannifesting itself in the Celestial plane or perhaps one of Jean's machines has gone wild....and he isn't aware of the flaw (unless it was planted there by Kobal)...some other ideas might be intriguing too... Hmmm..in any case these "natural" disasters give PCs a chance to see how people react to a crisis in Heaven. Idea 3: The Seventh Sign...before any others really.... Nearby Christopher's haunt he has a interesting heavenly feature nominally under his wardship (Yves might be more appropriate) a tower called the Guff after Demi Moore's Seventh Sign mention of the wellspring of all souls. The Tower is full of the souls of the yet to be born who are full of hope, promise, and ideals that basically in other words means that Yves hasn't gotton around to assigning them a destiny or place in the celestial scheme of things. Mostly they sleep, converse with each other (soulmates happen this way), and speculate on the material world and what will happen once they get there. Very much innocents, christopher or yves loves keeping them that way. Hmm maybe even Baladine...herrr...Still theres a finite number of souls in the darn thing since God left and he hasn't rebothered to fill it lately....it's still thankfully pretty full to those who want armageddon now. Well whoever operates this little place is hysterical because someone has just robbed the place. One single human spirit-it may be a servitor of Kronos, a Vapulite, or even just a young Christopher/Yveite who wanted to take the kid out for a spin...maybe it itself wandered off. However his numbers up soon and if he isn't born on time...well they don't know what will happen. Kronos might write the kid a fate but no destiny and the anti-christ is born, the 7th sign, the kid loses a chance to become a mortal and is stuck doing Reliever duty (more a punishment than you realize), or existence is undone (okay that last one's an exageration but I see Chris as going kiddy hysterical) Idea 4: Touched by an Angel adventures. I'm just going to be stealing from the average episode for inspiration for some down to earth episodes, mix in a few demons, and we'll get some real human interaction for the angels and spotlight some social issues. (aiding the Angel of Emanicipation in Sudan by taking vessels of both slave and underground railroader while the Balseraph of Slavery indulges his word, a hate rally of the worst sort in a small town while a man's soul hangs in the balance-and that of his sons who seeks to follow his father's foosteps despite his repentenc). IN Nomine just isn't In Nomine unless you have the angels really interacting with humans in their daily lives in realistic scenarios...world over. Idea 5: Backgrounds for 2 Superiors I was curious if I should make a really weird statement and reveal that Yves isn't of a choir for a very good reason-he's a human being. Basically he's nothing more than a human soul which either is from a previous universe or is the first of them before they were clothed in flesh. Representing all the ideals that humanity should aspire to. Thus his importance to their word. Kronos I was thinking of giving some motivation for the Last Temptation of Yves in that he isn't really any less loyal to the Creator (and thus why he can hear the Symphony-Nybblas can partially hear it too because despite all he wants people to be happy) but instead believes that he must create a balance with good/evil so that humans can choose good freely and without possibility of falling. Thus he abandoned Yves's service. There you go. - -Charlemagne ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1677 ******************************** The material here is (C) 2000 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.