From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Wed Jun 21 16:18:24 2000 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA02043 for ; Wed, 21 Jun 2000 16:18:24 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id QAA00116 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Wed, 21 Jun 2000 16:15:40 -0500 Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 16:15:40 -0500 Message-Id: <200006212115.QAA00116@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1687 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Wednesday, June 21 2000 Volume 01 : Number 1687 In this digest: Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon Re: IN> IN PBEM games Re: IN> IN PBEM games Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) Re: IN> Celestial Form Idea, Wind and Theft Dissonance Re:IN> Celestial Form Idea, Wind and Theft Dissonance Re: IN> Sad Fall of In Nomine (was: GURPS IN Canon) Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) IN> Superior opposites IN> Question re Balseraph resonance Opposites Attract (was Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) Re: IN> Sup4 cover (Re: GURPS IN Canon) Re: IN> Celestial Form Idea, Wind and Theft Dissonance Re:Opposites Attract (was Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) Re: IN> Adventure Plot Thingy II. Re: IN> IN PBEM games Re: IN> Sad Fall of In Nomine (was: GURPS IN Canon) Re:Opposites Attract (was Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) Re: IN> Adventure Plot Thingy II. Re:Opposites Attract (was Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) Re: IN> Sad Fall of In Nomine (was: GURPS IN Canon) Re: IN> Celestial Form Idea, Wind and Theft Dissonance Re:Opposites Attract (was Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (not so loooong) IN> Superior Books & whatnot (Re: GURPS IN Canon (loooong)) Re: IN> Question re Balseraph resonance IN> Re: Opposites Attract (was Re: GURPS IN Canon (loooong)) Re: IN> Question re Balseraph resonance Re: IN> Question re Balseraph resonance IN> Late Product (Humor, blessit, humor!) Re: IN> Celestial Form Idea, Wind and Theft Dissonance Re: IN> Late Product (Humor, blessit, humor!) Re: IN> Question re Balseraph resonance Re: IN> Question re Balseraph resonance Re: IN> Question re Balseraph resonance Re: IN> Question re Balseraph resonance ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 19:55:22 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon At 5:24 PM -0500 6/20/00, Andrew Hackard wrote: >At 09:29 AM 20/06/00 -0400, Whistling in the Dark wrote: >>Well, at least we should get to see cover art between now and then. >>Theoretically. > >Yes, because the cover art is pretty much done. I'd describe it, but >I can't do it justice. All I'll say is that it features Vapula quite >prominently, along with several of his soldiers. And shadows? Are there any shadows? - -- - -- Eric Alfred Burns - Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 20:22:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Emily Dresner Subject: Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon > >Yes, because the cover art is pretty much done. I'd describe it, but > >I can't do it justice. All I'll say is that it features Vapula quite > >prominently, along with several of his soldiers. > > And shadows? Are there any shadows? No, because they're behind the dumpster offscreen shooting up smack. - - Em ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 20:26:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Emily Dresner Subject: Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon > >Excellently planned to hit just when I'm out of the country for weeks. :) > > We aim to please. If you'll tell us your further travel plans, we can > fit the IN release schedule around them . . . :-) No no no no. Not travel plans. These are not travel plans. Escape plans. Y'see, by August 27th, putting an ocean between myself and everyone I know won't quite be enough, but it's going to have to do, because its as far as my dime would take me. Going to a country where we are assured to be left alone because we don't speak the language is a sanity gauge. But, in an IN vein, I'm going to buy as much Catholic kitsch as I can afford to mail back. :) - - Em (soon to be Dresner-Thornber) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 20:23:39 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) At 7:54 PM -0400 6/21/00, Whistling in the Dark wrote: > >Christopher/Mammon, Khalid/Magog. Actually, reverse those two. Children and Cruelty oppose well, and Faith and Greed seems natural. - -- - -- Eric Alfred Burns - Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 19:38:34 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon From: "Whistling in the Dark" > > > >Yes, because the cover art is pretty much done. I'd describe it, but > >I can't do it justice. All I'll say is that it features Vapula quite > >prominently, along with several of his soldiers. > > And shadows? Are there any shadows? They're all still working for the Babylon 5 games. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 19:40:45 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) From: "Whistling in the Dark" > > > >Christopher/Mammon, Khalid/Magog. > > Actually, reverse those two. Children and Cruelty oppose well, and > Faith and Greed seems natural. True, but Magog scares Christopher more than Mammon does. ;;;) (Personally, I'd put Zadkiel in opposition to Magog.) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 19:41:25 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon From: "Emily Dresner" > > But, in an IN vein, I'm going to buy as much Catholic kitsch as I > can afford to mail back. :) Saint Peter's is a wonderful cathedral to visit... > - Em (soon to be Dresner-Thornber) Congrats! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 18:14:16 -0700 (PDT) From: MANDY JON BOWYER Subject: Re: IN> IN PBEM games On Tue, 20 Jun 2000, Robert Knop wrote: > > > www.pbem.com is a good resource for PBEM games, but I never see any In > Nomine there. If I were to create a "In Nomine PBEM resource page", > would anybody be interested? > > -Rob I would be interested. Mandy ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 21:17:25 -0400 From: "EDG" Subject: Re: IN> IN PBEM games > www.pbem.com is a good resource for PBEM games, but I never see any In > Nomine there. If I were to create a "In Nomine PBEM resource page", > would anybody be interested? Definite interest here - and not just because it'd be fun to link from the In Nomine page. ^_^ - -EDG ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 01:50:14 +0100 From: Omentide Subject: Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) >Superior books were, for a time, THE most-asked-for expansion to the line. >(Often in the form of "one AA, one DP" instead of the 4-6 format we went >with. At least this way, if you pick up a book, there are 3-5 chances of >finding something you _love_...) (Out of sheer curiosity, which one(s) >did this happen with? Or is this hypothetical?) Mostly hypothetical. I read Superiors 2 (and loved it) first. I wasn't so keen on Superiors 1. The Superior that went most against the ideas I had (and was going to play with, and still might) was David. It's quite hard (and would take too long) to explain the precise problem I had with this material. Maybe it simplified what I'd previously perceived as complex, and I rather liked the complexity. > "The Line Editor says that con GMs >and MiBs can run the game this way, and you should be nice to them." >Send me an address and I'll print out a certificate and sign it. (If >The Rules Are Absolute, then She Who Approves The Rules gets to Make >RulesTo Get Around Rules, no?) Thanks for the offer, but I can cope with rules lawyers without a certificate. I just mislike the unpleasantness they can cause. And, on the whole, I do like to keep my Con scenarios as canonical as possible (and save all my heresies for games run at home). The first duty of a Convention Scenario is to be fun, the second duty of such a scenario is to showcase the product. Canon is part of the product. If people buy the product on the strength of having enjoyed a Con scenario and find that the product is seriously different from what they have been lead to believe... Well, I doubt if it violates the Trade Descriptions Act (or whatever the Stateside equivalent), but it does not make for good publicity. Hilary Ashley and Hilary omentide.omentide@virgin.net http://freespace.virgin.net/omentide.omentide ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 19:06:34 -0700 From: Ryan Elias Subject: Re: IN> Celestial Form Idea, Wind and Theft Dissonance Dave Taylor wrote: > 2: Wind and Theft Dissonance > Frankly, they suck if running a reasonably static campaign. Eh. Personally, I'd prefer to keep the dissonance conditions the same (in a game I run anyhow). I like to keep stuff low contrast, though, and in a better resolution game I can definately see the advantage of enforced kleptomania. (on the other hand, I consider all demons of theft to be Kleptos regardless of dissonance, so there you go) Cheers, Ryan ------------------------------ Date: 21 Jun 2000 02:30:32 -0000 From: "-=|horsefly|=-" Subject: Re:IN> Celestial Form Idea, Wind and Theft Dissonance On Tue, 20 Jun 2000 23:13:19 +0100 Dave Taylor wrote: >just a few ideas i've been rolling round my head > >1: 'Fixing' Celestial Song of Form brilliant. i just sent this to my current GM. i hope she approves it. of course, running a Kyriotate with the Attunements of Creation and Destiny as well as its own Superior, i have a vested interest in how she decides (for those who are interested, my PC has the Song at level 6; it's used said Song already to make a white San Francisco bum into a black teenager while it was inhabiting the bum's body). >Wind - It is dissonant for servitors of the wind to go a period of Eth >Forces days without causing a significant _Beneficial_ change in a >mortal's life. (higher level servitors may have a longer interval, but are >usually required to perform greater acts of change) > >Theft [snip] >Much more satisfactory, and it makes theft demons real kleptomaniacs, and >wind a more positive force for good. Theft's new Dissonace condition is perfect, but i'd prefer to keep Wind more neutral, more terrifying in their ability to change human lives for good or ill. my own basis for Wind is the Book of Job, but Beth's accused me of running Dark In Nomine, so there you go.... ;) thanks for the suggestions; i'll get back to you on what my GM rules. -=|horsefly|=- "It was a different time: a time of blood and guns and killings.... It was a time when killers needed saints, for so much of God's good work was being done." --SAINT OF KILLERS #4, Garth Ennis ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 21:35:32 -0500 From: David Edelstein Subject: Re: IN> Sad Fall of In Nomine (was: GURPS IN Canon) Patrick O'Duffy wrote: > Well, apart from that mess with Fleurity. Don't know what was wrong with me that > week. Still have to apologise some more to Emily Dresner for that. Em's been through worse during playtesting. - -David ------------------------------ Date: 21 Jun 2000 02:57:38 -0000 From: "-=|horsefly|=-" Subject: Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) On Wed, 21 Jun 2000 19:54:36 -0400 Whistling in the Dark wrote: >At 8:03 PM -0400 6/20/00, Elizabeth McCoy wrote: >>At 6:54 PM -0400 6/20/00, Galen G. Silversmith wrote: >>Not to mention trying to fit the frabbishnabber minor Superiors into >>such a model! >Litheroy/Alaemon, Zadkiel/Furfur, Christopher/Mammon, Khalid/Magog. > >Glad to be of help. > >(I am *so* dead...) Revelation/Secrets is the best fit. Protection/Hardcore and Children/Greed are cludgy fits. i can't recall what Magog's word is, nor how it contrasts with Faith. help! :) someone else's Judgment/Game, War/the War, Dreams/Nightmares are good ones. Gabriel and Beliel are so obvious that we don't even need to go there, and Janus and Valefor have been presented in Canon such that if a book of "opposites" ever came out, i'd expect the revelation to finally pop that the two are the same entity, with subsequent explanation of how he resides in both realms and nobody figuring it out. -=|horsefly|=- If I ever wanted to say 'gwrthwynebiad', I'd probably kill myself by choking on my own tongue. =) - --John Karakash ------------------------------ Date: 21 Jun 2000 03:01:15 -0000 From: "-=|horsefly|=-" Subject: IN> Superior opposites On Wed, 21 Jun 2000 20:23:39 -0400 Whistling in the Dark wrote: >At 7:54 PM -0400 6/21/00, Whistling in the Dark wrote: >> >>Christopher/Mammon, Khalid/Magog. > >Actually, reverse those two. Children and Cruelty oppose well, and >Faith and Greed seems natural. sehr, ja. vielen dank for altering that. appreciated. -=|horsefly|=- God is a comedian playing to an audience too afraid to laugh. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 20:25:37 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: IN> Question re Balseraph resonance Can someone who _wants_ to be affected by a Balseraph's resonance deliberately choose to fail a will roll? If yes, then note that the Bal could more or less resculpt the volunteer's psyche and memories through repeated applications of resonance as per the IPG. Doug M. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 23:57:31 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Gant Subject: Opposites Attract (was Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) On Tue, 20 Jun 2000, -=|horsefly|=- wrote: > someone else's Judgment/Game, War/the War, Dreams/Nightmares are > good ones. I've never really liked having War and The War as opposites. Not since Laurence became an Archangel, anyway. The Sword and The War seem to be much better opposites, on a conceptual level. Richard Gant - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Richard Gant's Gaming Ghetto: http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dunes/4656/ The Returners Final Fantasy Role-Playing Game Site: http://returners.simplenet.com/ or http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Matrix/5758/ - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 00:44:31 -0500 From: Andrew Hackard Subject: Re: IN> Sup4 cover (Re: GURPS IN Canon) At 08:05 PM 20/06/00 -0400, Elizabeth McCoy wrote: >At 5:24 PM -0500 6/20/00, Andrew Hackard wrote: > >Yes, because the cover art is pretty much done. I'd describe it, but I > >can't do it justice. All I'll say is that it features Vapula quite > >prominently, along with several of his soldiers. > >Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm! Can you give us a heads-up when it's on the web-page? >(I'm usually the _last_ to know, unless I happen to be haunting the site.) I'll try to remember to do so. :-) - -- "People are stupider than anybody." | hackard@io.com -- Tom Lehrer | AIM: Talthybias | ICQ: 19083015 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 00:38:30 +0100 From: Dave Taylor Subject: Re: IN> Celestial Form Idea, Wind and Theft Dissonance In article <002401bfdb0f$733579a0$d27c86cc@zianet.com>, ben wrote: > > Celestial form enables the user to mold their vessel. But it only > > lasts for CDxCelForces Rnds. > You could always use the Song of Possession, or bring along a > Kyriotate/Shedite, if the Song of Form is too short. the change isn't meant to be specifically for copying people, but for effecting semi-long term changes to ones vessel. > > 2: Wind and Theft Dissonance Frankly, they suck if running a > > reasonably static campaign. > At first, when I looked at the Windies and the Thefties, I thought, huh, > how can you *play* them if you have to stay in the same place? And then > I realized that they were meant for campaigns that moved around a lot. > If you wanna play an angel who is static, take a Superior who likes > Servitors to build themselves up in one location I see your point, but when my campaign is intended to be static, and the players want windies or thefties, you have to compromise somewhat. > I was about to post something witty about "Devil's Advocacy", and then I > thought, wouldn't it be cool if there really *was* a Devil's Advocate -- > Lucifer's attorney? Someone should write him up. Evil thoughts, evil thoughts (but it smacks of Wolfram and Hart a little too much) Dave - -- Long is the way, and hard, that out of Hell leads up to light - John Milton - Paradise Lost ICQ - 77214006 - Archangel Nine ------------------------------ Date: 21 Jun 2000 07:44:05 -0000 From: "-=|horsefly|=-" Subject: Re:Opposites Attract (was Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) On Tue, 20 Jun 2000 23:57:31 -0400 (EDT) Richard Gant wrote: >On Tue, 20 Jun 2000, -=|horsefly|=- wrote: >> someone else's Judgment/Game, War/the War, Dreams/Nightmares are >> good ones. >I've never really liked having War and The War as opposites. Not since >Laurence became an Archangel, anyway. The Sword and The War seem to be >much better opposites, on a conceptual level. granted. whom do we pair with War, then? *everybody?* ;) -=|horsefly|=- If I ever wanted to say 'gwrthwynebiad', I'd probably kill myself by choking on my own tongue. =) - --John Karakash ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 09:51:53 +0100 From: "Laurent" Subject: Re: IN> Adventure Plot Thingy II. Ben wrote: >> Just a thing, though: you're sending 2 Malakim on a mission in Hell?!? > I wanna teach one of 'em a lesson in restraint. He's the whacko who shot > an Impudite in the head -- three times -- when the Impudite was trying to > save him from Kobal I see what you mean. I had the same type of problems with the groups I was GMing before. The first time was with 2 Malakim attacking a building. All the exits were blocked but 1, and the 2 angels were waiting there with their weapons ready. All the guards came out (the room was on fire) of a large door (3 at a time), and the Malakim just kept on applying the following actions: 1) resonate guard 2) if resonance fails, knock him out if he's a good guy (they had a VERY selective judgement), knock him out if he's a bad guy, kill him (1 shot was usually enough). 3) wait for next wave of 3 guards In situations like that, the GM should definitely teach them a lesson... Sometimes however, players teach lessons to one another. 2 of my players (an Impudite and another demon - can't remember -) enter a shop and ask the owner for some info (knowing he knew the stuff). The Impudite starts negociating answers when the second demon (standing behind the Impudite) shoots the shop-keeper in order to motivate him. The Impudite just drew his gun, turned around, and shot the second demon straight in the head (using most of his essence on the CD). I just LOVED that moment!! Needless to say, the dying demon didn't do much during the rest of the adventure... > I didn't allow Malakim in my second In Nomine game, unless they were > Malakim of Novalis. Or maybe, maybe, maybe Eli. I'd probably do the same, and for Calabim as well. Unless I know the player will make a good interpretation of the Malakite/Calabite. Laurent. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 09:52:31 +0100 From: "Laurent" Subject: Re: IN> IN PBEM games I would be very interested as well. Laurent. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 07:30:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Emily Dresner Subject: Re: IN> Sad Fall of In Nomine (was: GURPS IN Canon) > Patrick O'Duffy wrote: > > Well, apart from that mess with Fleurity. Don't know what was wrong with me that > > week. Still have to apologise some more to Emily Dresner for that. > > Em's been through worse during playtesting. Heck, I've been through worse at work. Remember, I make computer toys for a living, and our playtesters know where my cube is. :) - - Em ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2000 08:45:43 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re:Opposites Attract (was Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) At 7:44 AM +0000 6/21/00, -=|horsefly|=- wrote: >On Tue, 20 Jun 2000 23:57:31 -0400 (EDT) Richard Gant wrote: >>On Tue, 20 Jun 2000, -=|horsefly|=- wrote: >>> someone else's Judgment/Game, War/the War, Dreams/Nightmares are >>> good ones. >>I've never really liked having War and The War as opposites. Not since >>Laurence became an Archangel, anyway. The Sword and The War seem to be >>much better opposites, on a conceptual level. > granted. whom do we pair with War, then? *everybody?* ;) *Drugs,* Man! - -- - -- Eric Alfred Burns - Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2000 08:57:17 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Adventure Plot Thingy II. At 9:51 AM +0100 6/21/00, Laurent wrote: >Ben wrote: > > >> I didn't allow Malakim in my second In Nomine game, unless they were >> Malakim of Novalis. Or maybe, maybe, maybe Eli. >I'd probably do the same, and for Calabim as well. Unless I know the >player will make a good >interpretation of the Malakite/Calabite. > I allow Malakim/Calabim in my games, but I also go from the premise that "Corporeal Duty" is an honor and a privilege for Angels, and one that's encumbant upon the Angel being able to operate in the Corporeal Realm moderately quietly and with a certain finesse. That doesn't mean all Angels have to be the same -- just that wanton slaughter will get you hauled up by your Superior and put on "sit by the Tether and wait for the next eight hundred years straight for any panic calls" duty -- or hauled up by the Celestial Inquisition so they can sit you down and ask *why* this Virtue feels his judgement is better than the Seraphim Council's and *God's* in terms of Corporeal Excesses...? As for Calabim, it's simple. If you start making so much noise that Heaven starts sending Malakim in groups of two or more into an area, every demon in the area guns for you. There isn't a single Prince who appreciates seeing one of his demons appear by his Heart -- it means a screwup. And by the time the Calabite comes out of Trauma, about six different spins on the story implicating the Calabite in all *sorts* of treason will have come up. That's if the Calabite is, once again, *lucky.* If he's *un*lucky, the Game finds him first, and has a little talk about decorum for the next four years straight with the boy.... (I like "Cold War," not "Hot War." All actions must lead to plausible deniability, or someone's going to have a *very* bad time of it.) - -- - -- Eric Alfred Burns - Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 06:07:06 PDT From: "Jo Hart" Subject: Re:Opposites Attract (was Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) > >At 7:44 AM +0000 6/21/00, -=|horsefly|=- wrote: >>On Tue, 20 Jun 2000 23:57:31 -0400 (EDT) Richard Gant >>wrote: >>>On Tue, 20 Jun 2000, -=|horsefly|=- wrote: >>>> someone else's Judgment/Game, War/the War, Dreams/Nightmares are >>>> good ones. >>>I've never really liked having War and The War as opposites. Not since >>>Laurence became an Archangel, anyway. The Sword and The War seem to be >>>much better opposites, on a conceptual level. >> granted. whom do we pair with War, then? *everybody?* ;) > Nightmares, because the only thing we have to fear is fear itself... jo ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 18:24:56 -0700 From: "Patrick O'Duffy" Subject: Re: IN> Sad Fall of In Nomine (was: GURPS IN Canon) Andrew Dawson wrote: > This was free advice and for you it was worth every penny. Do I need to put > huge disclaimers in every message that this is advice and that you are in > no way constrained to take it to heart or agree with it? Is the brusqueness actually necessary, Andrew? I'm not attacking you; out of 6 bits of 'advice', I agreed with one, questioned one and didn't comment on four (which I largely agreed with). No, you don't need to put in disclaimers. But maybe you need to think about the advice you're giving and whether it's appropriate for the forum you're posting it to. Like I said, this is a list of people who've _been_ spending money on IN books; telling us we should spend _more_ money is at best fairly useless. (For most people here, the only way we can 'vote with our wallets' is by _not_ buying further IN books - which is, of course, the problem. The votes are coming in, and IN's losing the election.) > 7. Write for or about In Nomine where potential fans will see it (articles, > reviews, etc.). > 8. Write some short, easy-to-use In Nomine adventures and give them to SJ > Games to display prominently on their website. If adventures don't sell, > maybe free adventures are still a good idea. And yes, I agree with this very much. You can find my free IN adventure on the INC ('Too too Solid Flesh'); with any luck, you'll eventually see an article on IN combat options on Pyramid. - -- Patrick O'Duffy, Brisbane, Australia It's been a long hard day scaring the shit out of children for the anticlowns of the Tolerable Terror Infant Therapy Institute. - Spider Jerusalem, TRANSMETROPOLITAN #23 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 09:25:48 -0600 From: "ben" Subject: Re: IN> Celestial Form Idea, Wind and Theft Dissonance > > You could always use the Song of Possession, or bring along a > > Kyriotate/Shedite, if the Song of Form is too short. > > the change isn't meant to be specifically for copying people, but for > effecting semi-long term changes to ones vessel. Hm. If the Song of Form was canonically as long-term as you suggest it to be, I would never buy multiple vessels except in heavy combat games. I'd just crank that song up to 6. Be a Kyriotate of Eli. > I see your point, but when my campaign is intended to be static, and the > players want windies or thefties, you have to compromise somewhat. If the campaign is intended to be static and the players want Windies or Thefties, you have a major problem with you wanting one kind of game and the players wanting another. Static + Wind? Say it with me, and tell me when your tongue seizes up. The way I cope with my semi-static game and my Servitor of Janus is I have the plots require the players to *go* places. They get given a name, and after researching it, find a man by that name on the east coast... so they go. Happy Janus. Happy Static. > Dave Ben ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 12:37:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Gant Subject: Re:Opposites Attract (was Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (loooong) On Wed, 21 Jun 2000, -=|horsefly|=- wrote: > >I've never really liked having War and The War as opposites. Not since > >Laurence became an Archangel, anyway. The Sword and The War seem to be > >much better opposites, on a conceptual level. > > granted. whom do we pair with War, then? *everybody?* ;) Hardcore, perhaps. Violence For The Sake Of Violence against Violence For A Purpose. (Of course, that puts Furfur into direct competition with Michael...) Then again, War probably *does* pair off against every Word in Hell. Michael's always struck me as an overachiever. Richard Gant - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Richard Gant's Gaming Ghetto: http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dunes/4656/ The Returners Final Fantasy Role-Playing Game Site: http://returners.simplenet.com/ or http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Matrix/5758/ - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 13:10:47 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> GURPS IN Canon (not so loooong) At 7:54 PM -0400 6/21/00, Whistling in the Dark wrote: >At 8:03 PM -0400 6/20/00, Elizabeth McCoy wrote: >>At 6:54 PM -0400 6/20/00, Galen G. Silversmith wrote: >> >>Not to mention trying to fit the frabbishnabber minor Superiors into >>such a model! > >Litheroy/Alaemon, Zadkiel/Furfur, Christopher/Mammon, Khalid/Magog. Yeah, right, Magog -- "History: been locked up for the past few thousand years. Gets let loose. Gets toasted (maybe) by Gabriel." Besides, it's Zadkiel/Fleurity. Where this leaves Furfur... >(I am *so* dead...) Just you wait. (Knew I shoulda done that Kyrio of Lightning...) - --Beth, catching up as she can, typing with a baby (iolanthe) in her lap. Vapitalizatoin and spelling still difficult, typing w/ 1 hand (and often a wigglebaby in the other). ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 13:32:40 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> Superior Books & whatnot (Re: GURPS IN Canon (loooong)) At 1:50 AM +0100 6/21/00, Omentide wrote: >>Superior books [...] (Out of sheer curiosity, which one(s) >>did this happen with? Or is this hypothetical?) > >Mostly hypothetical. I read Superiors 2 (and loved it) first. (I hope you know this makes the editor go all squishy. O:> ) > The Superior that went most against the ideas I had >(and was going to play with, and still might) was David. [...] >Maybe it simplified what I'd previously perceived as complex, >and I rather liked the complexity. He was a hard one (pun not intended), IIRC. Went through several different viewpoints (and authors), if you look at the mainbook-FOTM- Sup1 lists of credits. >> "The Line Editor says that con GMs >>and MiBs can run the game this way, [...] >Thanks for the offer, but I can cope with rules lawyers without a >certificate. Okay. Just figured I'd offer the bazooka if you were having any consistant problems. O:> (That goes for anyone else, too.) >[...] If people buy the >product on the strength of having enjoyed a Con scenario and find that the >product is seriously different [...] I understand. Oh, yeah, I understand... - --Beth, catching up as she can, typing with a baby (iolanthe) in her lap. Vapitalizatoin and spelling still difficult, typing w/ 1 hand (and often a wigglebaby in the other). ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 13:34:36 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Question re Balseraph resonance At 8:25 PM -0400 6/20/00, Douglas Muir wrote: >Can someone who _wants_ to be affected by a Balseraph's resonance >deliberately choose to fail a will roll? Or not resist in the first place, sure, I don't see why not. >If yes, then note that the Bal could more or less resculpt the volunteer's >psyche and memories through repeated applications of resonance as per the >IPG. Yup. And the volunteer will get everything that he or she deserves, betcha. - --Beth, catching up as she can, typing with a baby (iolanthe) in her lap. Vapitalizatoin and spelling still difficult, typing w/ 1 hand (and often a wigglebaby in the other). ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 13:40:42 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> Re: Opposites Attract (was Re: GURPS IN Canon (loooong)) I think the decision for "Same side, same theme" has been vindicated... O:> (Or, in other words, ya can't please everyone -- no matter whatcha do, someone curses your name, and, hopefully, someone else blesses it.) - --Beth, catching up as she can, typing with a baby (iolanthe) in her lap. Vapitalizatoin and spelling still difficult, typing w/ 1 hand (and often a wigglebaby in the other). ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 12:38:03 -0500 (CDT) From: Matthew Philip Walsh Subject: Re: IN> Question re Balseraph resonance On Wed, 21 Jun 2000, Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > At 8:25 PM -0400 6/20/00, Douglas Muir wrote: > >Can someone who _wants_ to be affected by a Balseraph's resonance > >deliberately choose to fail a will roll? > > Or not resist in the first place, sure, I don't see why not. Does that include the Balseraph itself? I seem to recall some way for a Balseraph to avoid dissonance by using its Resonance on itself in the IPG... It was implied there that such a Balseraph has to attempt and fail a Will roll to resist. Matt ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 14:02:06 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Question re Balseraph resonance At 12:38 PM -0500 6/21/00, Matthew Philip Walsh wrote: >On Wed, 21 Jun 2000, Elizabeth McCoy wrote: >> At 8:25 PM -0400 6/20/00, Douglas Muir wrote: >> >Can someone who _wants_ to be affected by a Balseraph's resonance >> >deliberately choose to fail a will roll? >> >> Or not resist in the first place, sure, I don't see why not. > >Does that include the Balseraph itself? I seem to recall some way for a >Balseraph to avoid dissonance by using its Resonance on itself in the >IPG... It was implied there that such a Balseraph has to attempt and fail >a Will roll to resist. That's a special case, to erase a note of dissonance. The Balseraph _must_ make the second Will roll, and risk the consequences. Otherwise, the Balseraph already "self-resonates," when it first creates its "internal truth" that it attempts to impose upon the outside world. (This is why a canny Balseraph won't say, "We're friends!" to a hostile -- if he makes his Will roll, _he_ believes! Even if the hostile being manages to resist! Oops. Instead, he says, "You're _my_ friend. (And I'm not saying if I like you much at all.)") I allow Balseraphs of Lust to "self-resonate" their attunement, too... O:> - --Beth, catching up as she can, typing with a baby (iolanthe) in her lap. Vapitalizatoin and spelling still difficult, typing w/ 1 hand (and often a wigglebaby in the other). ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 14:32:36 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> Late Product (Humor, blessit, humor!) There's a (highly favorable) review of INS/MV at http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/reviews/rev_3170.html . (Watch out for weird text sizes -- they're pounding on a few bugs.) In the review, it says: The worst thing: it's a french company, remember?. Nothing comes out at the prescribed date. Some supplements are a long time overdue (and by long time I do not mean a month but A YEAR!) their quality and usefulness varies a lot (from useless to masterpieces). It's a tradition! A _tradition_, carried directly over from the French! Or maybe a curse. Maybe that's the reason... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 07:53:18 +0100 From: Dave Taylor Subject: Re: IN> Celestial Form Idea, Wind and Theft Dissonance In article <20000621023032.7425.qmail@musone.chek.com>, -=|horsefly|=- wrote: > Theft's new Dissonace condition is perfect, but i'd prefer to keep Wind > more neutral, more terrifying in their ability to change human lives > for good or ill. my own basis for Wind is the Book of Job, but Beth's > accused me of running Dark In Nomine, so there you go.... ;) thanks > for the suggestions; i'll get back to you on what my GM rules. I run a high contrast fairly bright game usually, but of course the beneficial stipulation can be ignored, or treated in the coldest way (ie yes killing their child was beneficial. he would have grown up into a monster and murdered them and twelve other neighbours 15 years down the line) ew! I just creeped myself out :P Dave - -- Long is the way, and hard, that out of Hell leads up to light - John Milton - Paradise Lost ICQ - 77214006 - Archangel Nine ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 13:34:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Robert Knop Subject: Re: IN> Late Product (Humor, blessit, humor!) On Wed, 21 Jun 2000, Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > There's a (highly favorable) review of INS/MV at http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/reviews/rev_3170.html . (Watch out > for weird text sizes -- they're pounding on a few bugs.) If I remember it correctly, this is also the same review that thrashed on the SJG version as being uninteresting.... - -Rob ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 14:32:28 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: Re: IN> Question re Balseraph resonance >Yup. And the volunteer will get everything that he or she deserves, >betcha. Well, this came up IMC. A group of demons got hold of a Soldier, tortured some basic information out of him... then used Songs and the Balseraph's resonance to change one of their Hellsworn into a duplicate of the Soldier (and a duplicate who was absolutely certain that he _was_ Frank X. O'Leary, Soldier of Michael). They then sent the Hellsworn as a mole to infiltrate and spy out an angelic Tether... I ruled this permissible, but it got interesting when angels started resonating on the "Soldier". Would Mals and Mercs pick up the real Hellsworn persona, or the artificial one so carefully crafted by the Balseraph and his Habbalite assistant? "Hi, Frank," [tingle tingle] "Wait a sec..." I made an on-the-spot ruling that it would be a Contest between the angels' and demons' resonances, but I'd be interested to hear some other opinions on how to deal with this. Note, btw, that this is somewhat unusual... a more common use of the "unresisted" Balseraph resonance would be to make humans _happy_. Self-image problem? Can't stop smoking? Unbearable memories of childhood abuse? I, your dread and loving master, can help you... Doug M. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 16:54:34 -0400 From: Walter Milliken Subject: Re: IN> Question re Balseraph resonance At 20:25 -0400 6/20/00, Douglas Muir wrote: >Can someone who _wants_ to be affected by a Balseraph's resonance >deliberately choose to fail a will roll? Since you can choose to spend Essence on it, I don't see why you couldn't choose to be deliberately weak-willed and/or give in. - ---Walter ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 17:02:44 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Question re Balseraph resonance Douglas Muir wrote: > I ruled this permissible, but it got interesting when angels > started resonating on the "Soldier". Would Mals and Mercs pick > up the real Hellsworn persona, or the artificial one so carefully > crafted by the Balseraph and his Habbalite assistant? > "Hi, Frank," [tingle tingle] "Wait a sec..." I'd think it would fall apart very quickly, then. An Elohite might, on a low check digit, get a plausible reading, but I think a Malakite would get the actual good and bad deeds of the Hellsworn, and a Mercurian would get his actual social relations. A seraph would know that he truly *believed* himself to be "Frank," but on a check digit of 6 would also know who he really was and why. I'd think. How did it turn out in play, on the "contest of wills" mechanic? Earl ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 17:15:04 -0400 From: "Galen G. Silversmith" Subject: Re: IN> Question re Balseraph resonance > Return-Path: earlw@mc.com > Douglas Muir wrote: > > > I ruled this permissible, but it got interesting when angels > > started resonating on the "Soldier". Would Mals and Mercs pick > > up the real Hellsworn persona, or the artificial one so carefully > > crafted by the Balseraph and his Habbalite assistant? > > "Hi, Frank," [tingle tingle] "Wait a sec..." > > I'd think it would fall apart very quickly, then. An Elohite > might, on a low check digit, get a plausible reading, but > I think a Malakite would get the actual good and bad deeds of > the Hellsworn, and a Mercurian would get his actual social > relations. A seraph would know that he truly *believed* himself > to be "Frank," but on a check digit of 6 would also know who > he really was and why. I'd think. I don't know. Assuming "Frank" is a decent plant, how often would the angels actually use their resonnance on him? If you have no reason for suspecting he's been compromised, it might take a while until people noticed he was acting oddly and looked into why... ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1687 ******************************** The material here is (C) 2000 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.