in_nomine-digest Tuesday, April 23 2002 Volume 01 : Number 2611 In this digest: IN> Before the Fall? Re: IN> "You're a Mercurian WHAT?!?" Re: IN> Seneschal Question Re: IN> Chips Re: IN> "You're a Mercurian WHAT?!?" Re: IN> Sane Litheroy Re: IN> Crossbreeds (Re: Wild West) Re: IN> Crossbreeds (Re: Wild West) Re: IN> Crossbreeds (Re: Wild West) Re: IN> Crossbreeds (Re: Wild West) Re: IN> Crossbreeds (Re: Wild West) Re: IN> Lilim Celestial appearance Re: IN> Princess of Cute Re: IN> Seneschal Question Re: IN> Crossbreeds (Re: Wild West) IN> Suicidal Words (Was Seneschal Question) Re: IN> Suicidal Words (Was Seneschal Question) Re: IN> Picking up trouble Re: IN> Picking up trouble IN> In Hell's pay ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 22:24:47 +1000 From: "james walker" Subject: IN> Before the Fall? The Cathedral of Light resounded with song. Secure as Archangel of Light, Lucifer sat back, listening to the music with pleasure. He had so much to do - - there was always so much to do - but it was the anniversary of Timbul - the lighting of the first star. For a few hours he could relax, leave the administrative details behind, and simply remember what his Word was really about. It was so pleasant... "Star of The Morning, the Archangel of Valour wishes to speak to you.." He sighed. He had managed to forget the wargame which Valour & War were staging - for some reason Baal always seemed to interrupt these moments of relaxation; he was too driven to realise how much Lucifer needed them. 'Very well. The I suppose I must - do this'. And he remembered who he was, and where. The Cathedral disappeared, replaced by the sharp rocks and chilling wind of the Lower Hells; the Damned stood still, freezing, but unable to move - lobotomized so that they would sing when the Cathedral was present, and suffer mindlessly otherwise. 'No Baal' he mused, 'you'll never discover what I use my 10% of the Damned for - it would be bad for morale. But you should know better than to interrupt me - you'll pay for that.' But he wasn't too upset. After all, it could be Timbul whenever he wanted: just one of the advantages of being a Balseraph. James. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 05:50:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> "You're a Mercurian WHAT?!?" A good example of why War and the Sword have Mercurians; any good commander knows the value of intelligence (in the military sense), and Mercurians can provide that in spades. ===== Michael Walton, #US2002023848 "In film, the director is God. In documentaries, God is the director." - -- Alfred Hitchcock __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Games - play chess, backgammon, pool and more http://games.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 05:52:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Seneschal Question - --- "Brian C. Petery" wrote: > "Where do Angels go when they die? They go to pieces." Now _that's_ an IN tagline. > I got that out of a comic book called "Celestine." I > think it was written by > the guy that does Spawn. (I used to be a FanBoy! Now I > can't remember his name. I'm so ashamed.) Todd McFarlane -- and Spawn is an interesting take on Undead. ===== Michael Walton, #US2002023848 "In film, the director is God. In documentaries, God is the director." - -- Alfred Hitchcock __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Games - play chess, backgammon, pool and more http://games.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 06:00:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Chips - --- Maurice Lane wrote: > OK, those were weird. Neat, mind you, but weird. Did > you consider anything for Zadkiel - after all, she's > probably fond enough of cops.* > *You know. CHiPS. Not to mention Belial's version -- Fission Chips. };> ===== Michael Walton, #US2002023848 "In film, the director is God. In documentaries, God is the director." - -- Alfred Hitchcock __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Games - play chess, backgammon, pool and more http://games.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 12:49:22 -0400 From: "Eric Bertish" Subject: Re: IN> "You're a Mercurian WHAT?!?" > A good example of why War and the Sword have Mercurians; > any good commander knows the value of intelligence (in the > military sense), and Mercurians can provide that in spades. Not to mention psychological warfare: "Sent Elrond anonymous letter telling him purple does not suit his complexion. Expect to hear screams of rage all the way to Gap of Rohan." http://diaries.diagon.org/ ;) - -- Casca Still not king, dammit. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 10:30:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Sane Litheroy I rather like Bibliomancy -- that Attunement has great potential as a plot device. ===== Michael Walton, #US2002023848 "In film, the director is God. In documentaries, God is the director." - -- Alfred Hitchcock __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Games - play chess, backgammon, pool and more http://games.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 15:40:52 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Crossbreeds (Re: Wild West) At 10:01 PM -0500 4/19/02, David Edelstein wrote: >Elizabeth McCoy wrote: >> I dunno -- I think we got some cross-Choir stuff a while back, on the >> list... > >Here: > >http://www.amadan.org/Innomine/celestialvariants.html No, it wasn't your stuff. It was _before_ that. Someone had a Malafanite, or some such. If I remembered a keyword, I'd search for it, but there is no way I'm going to search on "Malakite" thankyouverymuch. Unless I've skipped timelines _AGAIN_, mind you, and am remembering one of the previous ones. This isn't the timeline where we have rap-disco, is it? - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor RPG links; Random name list, Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 15:53:48 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Crossbreeds (Re: Wild West) Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > No, it wasn't your stuff. It was _before_ that. Someone had a > Malafanite, or some such. If I remembered a keyword, I'd search for > it, but there is no way I'm going to search on "Malakite" > thankyouverymuch. Well, I posted a thing called "Hybrid Choirs" on 5 April 2001. You could search on "hybrid" or "seraph-elohite" or "cherub-ophanite" or "elohite-mercurian" or "malakite-mercurian." Or I could re-post it. It was short. > This isn't the timeline where we have rap-disco, is it? Good Lord, I hope not. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 16:15:07 -0400 From: Robb Kidd Subject: Re: IN> Crossbreeds (Re: Wild West) * Earl Wajenberg (earlw@mc.com) wrote: > Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > > This isn't the timeline where we have rap-disco, is it? > Good Lord, I hope not. "Stayin' Alive" by N'Trance - - http://www.radikal.com/audio/StayinAlive.ram ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 13:19:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Crossbreeds (Re: Wild West) - --- Earl Wajenberg wrote: > Well, I posted a thing called "Hybrid Choirs" on 5 April > 2001. > You could search on "hybrid" or "seraph-elohite" or > "cherub-ophanite" > or "elohite-mercurian" or "malakite-mercurian." You can call me Ray(phael), or you can call me Jay(nus)... If nobody gets that, I'm really showing my age. If everybody gets it, we're all showing our age. ===== Michael Walton, #US2002023848 "In film, the director is God. In documentaries, God is the director." - -- Alfred Hitchcock __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Games - play chess, backgammon, pool and more http://games.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 18:45:54 -0400 From: EDG Subject: Re: IN> Crossbreeds (Re: Wild West) At 03:53 PM 4/22/02 -0500, you wrote: >Well, I posted a thing called "Hybrid Choirs" on 5 April 2001. >You could search on "hybrid" or "seraph-elohite" or "cherub-ophanite" >or "elohite-mercurian" or "malakite-mercurian." Or I could re-post it. >It was short. Or one could check the INC. (Heaven forfend! :) http://www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/articles/new/Players/Resources/hybrid.html - -EDG ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 18:43:01 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Lilim Celestial appearance At 10:38 AM -0400 4/21/02, Brian C. Petery wrote: >But seriously, I think that a Vessel is "standard issue" for Lilim. The IN >rule book is vague on this. If a Vessel isn't part of the creation process >Lilith would have to "give birth" in Hell or the Marches. Most Lilim are created in Hell, yes. They are not birthed. They don't get a vessel for free. (Sometimes they deal with Mother for a vessel, sometimes they deal with someone else. Body by Lust, Body by Nybbas, Body by Valefor... That sort of thing.) (IMC, you can sometimes get a young vessel from Kronos, but he tends to add freckles.) >In "The Final Trumpet," when Lilith is "fixing" Mira Klein, Lilith seems to >doing it in Blandy's Tower. It's unclear there -- it's probably at least the Marches, though presumably Blandine could shield someone from Heaven's Light in the celestial portion of her Tower. Whatever the GM thinks is reasonable. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor RPG links; Random name list, Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 18:51:38 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Princess of Cute At 6:30 PM -0400 4/21/02, Brian C. Petery wrote: >Just made me think of something... > >Demon Prince of Toddlers? of Brats? of the Terible Twos? She's cute enough to make up for it, even 2 years after. O:> (Mostly around OTHER PEOPLE, mind, but still...) - --Beth, Demon Princess of Nitpicking http://www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/articles/INChar/Demons/Prince.Beth.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 19:02:42 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Seneschal Question At 9:58 PM -0400 4/18/02, William J. Keith wrote: >[...] Wouldn't all but the youngest celestials regard >these as fleeting things, something you wouldn't want to be bound to? The answer to this depends on which side you focus on... For a demon, power is power, and if your Prince taps you for this job... make the most of it and hope you can build into something that lasts long enough to get your life saved by being re-bound to a future Tether... For an angel, well... They're more selfless. Does this stronghold need someone managing it _now_? Does one's Archangel think that one is the best choice to do so? Well, there you have it. >This question first struck me when I saw that a Malakite Seneschal was >Word-bound to the Treaty Oak, and is in decline with it. But no matter >what you do to a liveoak, it will have a lifespan of a few centuries at >most before it succumbs to natural age. (As a side note, which I just remembered, there's some cloning of trees being done... Perhaps the Old Guy would have a new lease...) >[...] If >at all possible, Word-bound Seneschals would be bucking to have their Word >expanded to some concept the Tether embodies, so they could get out of >there and have some other poor stiff get the sword of Damocles hanging over >their head. Hmmm... The Old Guy as the Angel of Treaties... That's a keen idea. Makes sense, too. >In summary, the notion of Word-binding Seneschals to Tethers seems way too >common and is far too sought-after a Word. Am I laboring under a >misapprehension? I'm not sure -- I'd think about it more deeply, but there's an awake toddler on my lap and I need to prep for a game tomorrow... O:> Remember that the Liber Castellorum was written after several of the Revelations Cycle books, and therefore had to work with what had already been stated in previous books. (And you're the first person to bring any of that up; I don't recall a playtester doing so!) Another aspect you may be overlooking is that, though they're immortal, celestials still live one day at a time -- a lot of them (especially demons) may not have mastered the idea of "Sometime down the road, this is gonna make me REAL sick." Power Now is more attractive. And Word-promotion to something that encompasses both the idea of the Tether, and something even more powerful, is always the gold ring to reach for... - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor RPG links; Random name list, Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 19:12:04 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Crossbreeds (Re: Wild West) At 3:53 PM -0500 4/22/02, Earl Wajenberg wrote: >Well, I posted a thing called "Hybrid Choirs" on 5 April 2001. >You could search on "hybrid" or "seraph-elohite" or "cherub-ophanite" >or "elohite-mercurian" or "malakite-mercurian." Or I could re-post it. >It was short. Oh, sure, if it's under 10K. It's been over a year. O:> (Either that, or we find URL and whatnot...) Oh, good, it's on the INC. >> This isn't the timeline where we have rap-disco, is it? > >Good Lord, I hope not. Whew. That was a hard one; I had to keep myself from killing the radio, and you don't want to know what the Eli picture looked like. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor RPG links; Random name list, Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 17:44:41 -0700 From: "Phillip DesJardins" Subject: IN> Suicidal Words (Was Seneschal Question) > Another aspect you may be overlooking is that, though they're immortal, > celestials still live one day at a time -- a lot of them (especially demons) > may not have mastered the idea of "Sometime down the road, this is gonna > make me REAL sick." Actually, I always looked at most of the Words Heaven's giving out and decided that there's no way these Words would be given if it weren't for the War. "Sacrifices must be made", yadda yadda yadda. Think of it. Many of the lesser Words that are given out have a lifespan of a few centuries. Angels thought in terms of MILLIONS of years before the War. This is an insane sacrifice some of them are making, to help defeat an enemy that they see as having the potential to destroy all of creation and all it stands for. Those who take these Words are effective martyrs to the cause. With Hell, such Words come in 2 forms: Lucifer getting annoyed, or else a Demon who thinks he can make it big. The first is the hardest to survive: Hell thrives on object lessons. The second is a gamble: can you take this Word which is essentially the proverbial Ticking Time Bomb and parlay it into something that will sustain you, rocket you into the ranks of Princehood? Or will it take you down with it. I think this is why Lucifer grants those Words in the first place. After all, without ambition Hell would have no purpose. Phillip, Mercurian of Novalis The Happy Shiny Mercurian "The world needs a hug" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 21:19:18 -0400 From: "Josh Moger" Subject: Re: IN> Suicidal Words (Was Seneschal Question) The second is a gamble: can you take this >Word which is essentially the proverbial Ticking Time Bomb and parlay it >into something that will sustain you, rocket you into the ranks of >Princehood? Which begs the question... just how many times has the Word of Ticking TIme Bomb been handed out? As many as, or more than, the number of times the Word of Irony has been given? Josh ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 22:15:31 -0400 From: "Eric Bertish" Subject: Re: IN> Picking up trouble > "Own private Armageddon"? I like that. It's sort of like "Your own > personal Jesus." > > Hrm, there's something there. I just can't articulate it right now. =) It might interest you to know that I call my campaign "Victims of Our Own Ontology" (VO4 for short). We're all insane. I think EDG will attest to that. - -- Casca "Many people hear voices when no-one is there. Some of them are called mad and are shut up in rooms where they stare at the walls all day. Others are called writers and they do pretty much the same thing." --Margaret Chittenden, writer ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 22:19:08 -0400 From: "Eric Bertish" Subject: Re: IN> Picking up trouble > Hey, Dave! I think I've found out where the bloody > hammer is: Casca hid it in another campaign! *speechless* The thing is, I'd do it if I could figure out *how*. That'd be one hell of a game session. Me: "Okay, you've managed to find Meginjord in the VO4 continuum, but to find Jarngreipr you have to travel to Eric Burns' game and get it there. And Mjolnir? Well, David Edelstein is willing to discuss the terms of your surrender...." ;) - -- Casca "Many people hear voices when no-one is there. Some of them are called mad and are shut up in rooms where they stare at the walls all day. Others are called writers and they do pretty much the same thing." --Margaret Chittenden, writer ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 23:57:23 +1000 From: "james walker" Subject: IN> In Hell's pay The thought struck me - most dreamshades serving the pagan gods would have Infernal Rites. The logic goes like this: A dreamshade continuously feels the pull of the Celestial realm, and can release their hold on the Ethereal realm at any time, travelling to their final reward. This is a problem for the pagan gods. Every time one does so, they lose a Servitor, and they can't recruit sufficient replacements. Of course, a dreamshade who is going to go to Hell is going to hang around longer than one who is going to reincarnate, and still longer than one destined for Heaven: they've got more motivation to avoid their final destination. And Hell wants as many souls damned as possible. So it is in the best interests of both Hell and the pagan gods to have their worshippers given an Infernal Rite each: the pagan gods get to keep them longer (and they're more powerful to boot) and Hell gets them all in the long run. Granted that not all of the ethereals will be arranging this. The Hindu pantheon probably doesn't see the point - they still have a decent Corporeal supply of worshippers, and don't have any time for Hell. The Norse gods would see this as proof of their beliefs: their refusal to deal with Hell means that they have fewer - and less powerful - worshippers than their foes, which is why they will lose at Ragnarok. The rest, however - the temptation would be immense. The ethereals know that they're mortal, and cannot survive without their worshippers; they get to make their worshippers stronger; and it's a way of getting revenge for the Purity Crusade. Besides, their worshippers want the power... Blessings, James. ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #2611 ********************************