============ OGRE/GEV list, April 7th (Last: April 4th) ============= ===== Minis web page From: OHara Walter From: SFsupply@aol.com ===== Random replies From: garth.getgen@genie.com ===== Copter Choppers From: sdorr@ix.netcom.com (Scott David Orr) ===== Help needed with ludography... From: sj@io.com (Steve Jackson) ------------------------------ From: OHara Walter Subject: Minis web page >> You stumbled onto the Reverisco home page, a wonderful; source of >>Ogre-type miniatures for us for our Ogre Minaitures games. I believe the >>URL is http://www.halcyon.com We've gotten some great models from >>John's (stuff snipped) I think the URL reference is incorrect here. I tried this link and apparently Halycon.com has been subsumed into something else. There are a bundle of older personal webpages on the site but no reference to Reverisco. Do you have other POC information? Walt O'Hara ----- From: SFsupply@aol.com Subject: Minis web page Wow! Love your chopper article Garth. Hey Steve, if a 2nd Ogre book ever goes to print, I think this article should definitely go in. Just needs a bit of polish. The actual URL for the Reviresco Home Page is http://www.halcyon.com/shamrock When I tried without the shamrock it only got me as far as the Northwest com hub. Yes, the site is terrific. Even if, like me, you have big armies of the Ral Partha Combine and Paneuropean stuff, the minis available through this site will have you drooling. Be sure to check out the online catalog. Great prices too! Henry, just wanted to say thanks for continuing this service for all of us. Its really appreciated. At your service, flunky (Gaahhhh! Somebody help me! I'm reaching for my checkbook and I can't stop!!) ------------------------------ From: garth.getgen@genie.com Subject: Random replies Many replies. Henry, I hope it's OK to do it this way. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ RE: Playtest report request > I'll post them over on the 'Web newsgroup REC.GAMES.BOARD I've done this, by the way ... but all I did was put LINKS in to point to Henry's page and the specific archive file (GEV96JUL.LZH), and told them which text file to read from that (GEVJUL03.TXT). I also put a LINK to the OGRE page on Steve Jackson's 'Web Page. Hope you don't mind the free advertisement. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > [Why doesn't everything in range get huge bonuses on their "anti-air" > (Cruise Missile) rolls, whenever a helicopter flies past? (They are > MUCH easier targets than the missiles.) That's a thought. However, I attempted to take care of that by lowering the defense rating during "normal" flight. If the chopper is in NOE flight, it's low enough to the ground it's essentially a ground unit for all practical purposes. On the other hand, you are correct: while in "contour" (or "normal", if you wish) flight, LASERS will pick choppers off like flies. Also, choppers will be VERY susceptable to CRUISE MISSILE nukes. I'll have to include that when I write the formal rules set. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > So AIRSTRIKE is just a variant, and further chopper, etc., rules > are a variant on a variant...sorry, Garth. Mr. Jackson ... I think you misunderstood me: I didn't want to supplement David's AIRSTRIKE rules -- I want to REPLACE them entirely because, in my not-so-humble opinion, they do NOT work. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > From: Scott R Pyle > BTW, Garth, love your treatment of this unique unit! Thanks! And since I've got encourgement, I'll give you another : Multi-Rocket Launch System (MRLS) This is actually an "archaic" unit left over from the late 20th and early 21st Centuries, the predecessor of the MISSILE TANK. Unlike the "modern" weaponry of the late 21st Century, this unit was never upgraded to fire "smart" weapons. Instead, it saturates the area with "cluster bombs" (these ARE more powerful than those originally used) for maximum effect. However, this comes at a cost: while the MRLS as a longer range than any other unit in the game, it is "myopic" in that it has a MINIMUM range setting (it needs time for the cluster bombs to spread out for proper coverage); and it can not get enough ordnance on any one spot to effectively kill an Armor unit. Here's the stats of the MRLS: Attack: 3 - read as SPILLOVER (factor has already been halfed) Range: 12 (24") with minimum range of 4 (8") Defense: 1 - doubled in TOWN Movement: 1 (2") as a LIGHT TANK I once posted a rule I wrote for "Long Range Suppression Fire" (double the range but for SPILLOVER only) -- this unit can NOT use that rule, as it's already "built in" to the design. As to a miniatures version of this unit, it's actually TWO vehicles (or, more likely, one articulated vehicle), one for the launcher and the other for the loader and ammunition racks. > You stumbled onto the Reverisco home page, a wonderful source of > Ogre-type miniatures for us for our Ogre Miniatures games. I believe > the URL is http://www.halcyon.com Yep, I think that's the place. Perhaps Mr. Jackson should look into having them do plastic figure under licence as an alternative to metal miniatures. I think most serious players would still shell out a bit more money for metal since they're much better quality, but some of us are on a budget (or just too dang cheap!). On the other hand, I was wondering about them using "GEV" to describe some of their figures now ... is that OK with the copyright holder??? > The Janus Mk VII pictured there, after some modifications on > our end, is now our "Hover Ogre," or Ogre GEV, if you will. You know, this is only marginally better (in my mind) than the flying "Ogre Magi" in the OGRE Book. I really can't see how you're going to lift THAT much weight on a hovercraft. I just can't picture it. Also, you have to watch the "strike range" (movement + firing range), because anything with a strike range of more than eight (8) hexes (16") will make the fixed Howitzer obsolete. Right now, the only two units that can do this is an OGRE Mark-IV firing Missiles and my (unoffical) Attack Helicopter firing an Ammo Pack from normal flight mode ... but both of those have a limited ammunition supply. Oh, and the MRLS above ... but that can only fire as a SPILLOVER attack. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > [Hey, I already KNOW how to power an X-ray laser (and if it's killing > things that take nukes to kill, it's gotta be X-rays, right?) > > Simply set off a nuke in a confined space. -HJC] Well, that all depends. Supposably, even the Infantry are firing nuclear rounds (personnally, I don't buy that part of the game background); so if that IS the only way to power an X-ray laser, it still doesn't take a very big power source. On the other hand, if it takes a full CRUISE MISSILE type of nuke, then I don't see how you can fire one from a LASER TOWER and still have a building left afterwards. Besides, who knows where laser technology will be in a hundered years??? Garth L. Getgen ----- [Let's assume that physics isn't terribly revised in the next century. There are two plausible ways of generating the effect of OGRE lasers: A> Set off a nuke and lase in X-rays. B> Use a railgun and launch plastic pellets at 50 km/s. (At that speed plastic is MORE impressive than metal, because it engages in contact fusion.) Either one of these should fit in a Mk-III, but not anything smaller. (I keep picturing the return of big gun battleships, as ASAT weapons to provide defensive cover for battlegroups) As for the MLRS, yet another unit that is totally ineffective against OGREs? -HJC] ------------------------------ From: sdorr@ix.netcom.com (Scott David Orr) Subject: Copter Choppers > [Why doesn't everything in range get huge bonuses on their >"anti-air" (Cruise Missile) rolls, whenever a helicopter flies past? >(They are MUCH easier targets than the missiles.) That would seem obvious to me: they're not a fragile little missile, but a full-sized unit, with armor. >From: sj@io.com (Steve Jackson) >The official word on air units in Ogre is and remains: they are not an >important battlefield presence because they die too easily. > >While this can be, and is, dressed up with all kinds of technological >justification, the REASON is that I wanted to do a tank game, not a >planes-killing-tanks game. Therefore, attempts to convince me that >aircraft might be able to survive are doomed to failure :-) "Don't >confuse me with facts, my mind is made up." Ogre is a tank game. > >So AIRSTRIKE is just a variant, and further chopper, etc., rules are a >variant on a variant...sorry, Garth. How about an optional rule? You can have rules for them (and call them whatever you want) without forcing people to use them. >From: garth.getgen@genie.com >It's not a bad idea, but doesn't help much when the battle is over Munich or >Moscow. There's even a question in my mind how far up river you want to >take a deep-water Cruiser. I'll have to check with my wife's co-workers on >that one (she's in the Navy Reserve). You don't want to take it at all -- submarines, missile batteries, etc.! It's just too easy to hide stuff on a coastline, and on a river you have _two_ coastlines really, really close. Scott Orr ----- [The Cruise missile is fairly BIG (Even a Mk-VI is too small to mount a reasonable number of them) and like the OGREs is almost solid armor, with minimal airfoils. (Plus it isn't bothered by 10G turns) -HJC] ------------------------------ From: sj@io.com (Steve Jackson) Subject: Help needed with ludography... Here's an edition I don't have a copy of - can someone who DOES have it fill in the blanks for me? (And if you see one in good shape on a dusty shelf somewhere, I want it - but if you are reading this message in an archive, I've probably already got one...) G.E.V. (2nd Edition) Metagaming, 197 ? . Designed by Steve Jackson. Boxed (4" x 7"); color cover by Brian Wilson (we think ???) , map (same as first edition?) and counters (same as first edition?) in a 4" x 7" cardboard box. Print run unknown. Suggested retail price was $4.95??. This is the last gap in the file, AFAIK. Steve Jackson - yes, of SJ Games - yes, we won the Secret Service case Learn Web or die - http://www.sjgames.com/ - dinosaurs, Lego, Kahlua! The heck with PGP keys; finger for Geek Code. Fnord. ------------------------------ Henry J. Cobb hcobb@io.com http://www.io.com/~hcobb All OGRE-related items Copyright (c) 1997, by Steve Jackson Games.