============ OGREverse list, Sep 3rd (Last: Aug 26th) ============= ===== Stealth and micronukes From: Wrazor@aol.com ===== Ammunition From: Fish Flowers ===== GURPS Ogre From: "Walter O'Hara" ------------------------------ From: Wrazor@aol.com Subject: Stealth and micronukes Man, a lot of subjects to cover under one heading, but here goes: Nuclear munitions: When I said I wasn't sure what a micronuke is, I really had two questions in mind. First, how small can you make a tactical nuke in terms of yield. Because of the physics of nuclear fission, there is practical minimum to the mass of fuel that can be ignited. I have not as yet found an answer to this question, either because I haven't figured out where to look, or because it is classified (except for the Chinese, but that's a discussion for another board). If anyone can supply the current answer to the question, I would be interested. Second, how large does the weapon have to be, to be effective against BPC as described. The larger this number is the worse the environmental impact of using these weapons. The smaller the number the less likely that nukes would be used in favor of conventional (and very effective antitank weapons) As to someone's statement that "plutonium fission is not the only way to make a nuclear weapon," he is right to this extent you could also use uranium-235 or some other fissile material. However, nuclear weapons are either strictly fission weapons or they are fusion weapons (neutron bombs are specialized fusion weapons). The trouble is the only way we can produce the conditions required to initiate fusion in a bomb is to put it in the middle of fission explosion -- ALL nuclear weapons rely on "plutonium" fission. And if any significant number of these weapons fail to be detonated the war is perforce going to be "dirty." Cold fusion is not an option. First, there is no clear consensus that it even exists; the experiments (even in the pro-cold fusion camp) do not produce consistently reproducible results. Moreover, if ti does exist the energy production is to slow to make an effective weapon. I can say this with a fair degree of certainty, because I checked into it, having thought the phenomena had been debunked some years back. And no, depleted uranium cannot be used to make "micronukes." The thing that makes it "depleted," is that it has been processed to remove the fissionable isotope uranium-235 leaving behind the non-fissionable U-238. As for "hiveloc" rounds, it seems to me, you are going to either be shooting very shallow trajectories at short ranges (requiring rules very close to laser line-of-sight) or very high trajectories causing the projectile to slow down to terminal velocity (admittedly no small velocity of a very dense projectile, but probably "hiveloc" Stealth: First of all, regarding those Iraqi and Kosavar tanks, those are examples of what I would call "defensive stealth." Ogre/GEV already supplies rules for camoflage and defensive cover. MY question was about units getting behind enemy lines and attacking covertly using "offensive stealth" (similar but not quite the same). Moreover, although we got off on this "reality" track, I was more interested in opinions on stealth units from a game perspective. I haven't really heard much about this. Would it be fun, cool, neat or not. Lastly on the subject of reality. I understand most of the points on salvage and when pursued in this manner find it totally rational. I don't think however, that just because we make our weapons modular/interchangeable among our systems, we are going to try to make our systems interchangeable with theirs so that we can make use of them. After all, that sword would cut both ways. I really don't think the game is even close to reality for the reasons mentioned and many others. You are welcome to believe that it is; you'll be wrong, but that's your right ;) But I don't see the point of debating it. After all, no game is really that realistic, there are just too many variables to consider and the scale of the game tends to blur distinctions. And only a psycho would that a totally realistic portrayal of a nuclear war (or any war) would be fun. Wray Odom ----- [Actually, you can set off a fission/fusion reaction without sending ANY atoms to the target. My favorite is near c neutrons, cause they're small, dense and relatively stable without any electric field to throw off your aim. But you could settle for little chunks of plastic at a slightly slower speed. -HJC] ------------------------------ From: Fish Flowers Subject: Ammunition Todd Zircher writes: > I'm still of fan of rail guns firing BPC slugs. After all, it's an > easy material to salvage compared to mining fissionable materials > and refining them. For what it's worth, GURPS Ogre represents most weapons as railguns firing conventional ammunition -- SATNUC (Saturation Nuclear clusters) rounds seem to be secondary ammunition, for big targets. Fish Flowers. ------------------------------ From: "Walter O'Hara" Subject: GURPS Ogre I snapped up GURPS OGRE as soon as I found it. I think it's wonderful for a background setting (perhaps combined with SJG's LEGIONS OF STEEL or some other dystopian sourcebook). My only major dissapointment was the dearth of illustrations for the non-standard OGREs (MKs I, II, IV, and VI). | I'd like to second Duncan McEwen's assessment of SJG's | GURPs OGRE. My only disappointment with the whole | chapter on the OGRE Variants, there were no dimensions | given for each OGRE. While there are volumes given, it's | hard to extrapolate dimensions from totals. Maybe someone | else can tell me the exterior dimensions of each OGRE | variant. | | Eric Homepage: waltohara.freeservers.com PBeM Emporium: pbem.brainiac.com ----- [I put in my order a while back, but they seem to be delivering it via militia. Really, I see the need for more material as more of an opportunity than a problem, but it depends on how well the first book sells. -HJC] Henry J. Cobb ogre@sjgames.com http://www.io.com/~hcobb All OGRE-related items Copyright (c) 2000, by Steve Jackson Games.